Simon Smith Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 A Warning to all the welders on here, which is most of us at some time. This link was posted on one of the tractor forums, and it makes scary reading. It may take a minute for the page to load, but it's worth the wait. http://www.brewracingframes.com/id75.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Since it's being quite slow to download, I've stolen it and uploaded it to my server: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 oooh - food for thought definitely. have to admit that I tend not use use chemicals when I am welding - physical cleaning (ie grinding, sanding, etc) is the only way to get things really clean. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lansalot Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Phosgene, from wikipedia: "This colorless gas gained infamy as a chemical weapon during World War I". Yikes ! Might have a gander round the shed tonight, just on the off-chance... Don't expect there'll be any however. Kind of suspicious of the article a little though... http://www.bt.cdc.gov/agent/phosgene/basics/facts.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 I used Wynns clutch and brake cleaner almost every day - it doesn't say anything about dangerous gasses or anything like that. It just says 'irritant' 'highly inflammable' 'dangerous to the environment'. I clean my hands with it sometimes as well. I guess the guy should read the label before using the product - a lack of common sense really that could have killed him. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 The phosgene is produced as a result of heating the tetrachloroethylene in an air free atmosphere - that is the heat provided by the welding combined with the shielding gas stopping any oxidisation (as would usually happen in air) has produced sufficient poisonous gas in this instance to cause those effects. The brake cleaner in it's normal form is as safe as it ever was (!) and naturally would not cause the effects. There is nothing in the cdc article that casts doubt on the account in the article - to my mind it seems to support most of what the article says. Les, are you saying that you fully read all the instructions, warnings and the list of ingredients when using products... just my unqualified 2p... Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 have to admit that I tend not use use chemicals when I am welding Whilst the article makes scary reading, no doubt about it, I have to agree with Mark, I don't think I've ever used a solvent or chemical during preperation for welding, also, I can't think of any other situations where I'd ever have heat, argon and chemicals in the same place at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Yes - I read warnings and instructions. I have a modelling career to think of Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wozza35 Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Yes - I read warnings and instructions. I have a modelling career to think of Les. What are you Les a sock model Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous doug Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 oooh - food for thought definitely. have to admit that I tend not use use chemicals when I am welding - physical cleaning (ie grinding, sanding, etc) is the only way to get things really clean. Mark what he said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Ive never seen tetrachloroethylene listed as an active ingredient in brake/carb cleaner. They usually contain xylene. Maybe its just not listed, or maybe its just not used very much in this country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardAllen Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Er, standard practice: welding a diesel tank, cleaning with solvent, heating tank with acetylene torch to get rid of solvent. I may be only an occasional welder, or got the very wrong end of the stick, but is this guy not very lucky that he had not blown himself to kingdom come in a gas explosion long ago ?? Richard the soap and water cleaning person who hates hydrocarbons in any confined space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoggyN Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Ive never seen tetrachloroethylene listed as an active ingredient in brake/carb cleaner.They usually contain xylene. Maybe its just not listed, or maybe its just not used very much in this country. Wynn's brake cleaner certainly does - albeit by another name. Wynn's brake cleaner safety sheet Nasty stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_d Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 I use Comma brake cleaner which is primarily NAPHTHA. I thought tetrachloroethylene was banned in the UK. On second thoughts that may have been trichloroethylene. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 I use Comma brake cleaner which is primarily NAPHTHA.I thought tetrachloroethylene was banned in the UK. On second thoughts that may have been trichloroethylene. Steve Yep, trichloroethylene is not allowed any more. Used to love the smell of the original Tippex when it contained tricho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 I think it's the case that thanks to the USA's unique approach to the environment and pollution, they're still allowed all the good stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superpants Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Had a look at the wynns stuff at home last night- No tetrachloroethylene- Naptha and Petrololum instead, which a quick look at other Safety Data sheets on the web (eg Wurth) seems to be the common composition in the UK. IIRC although not outrightly banned, most halogonated solvents have been phased out for general commercial use- You can still buy them from special chemical suppliers but not your average motor factor. I know we had problems on my industrial placement getting hold of some for lab use and that was 10 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Handy_Andy Posted August 1, 2009 Share Posted August 1, 2009 Yep, trichloroethylene is not allowed any more. Used to love the smell of the original Tippex when it contained tricho Although you can use up to a ton a year with a licence from the local goverment. A lot of the companys processing parts for the aircraft industry still have to use it as its the only product aproved by the OEMs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest noggy Posted August 1, 2009 Share Posted August 1, 2009 Another warning to welders... wear long sleeved shirts! this happened about 4 weeks ago, and i now have a really odd tan line and my skin burns really easy in the sun.... not that we get much in derbyshire! left arm Inner biceps right arm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted August 1, 2009 Share Posted August 1, 2009 Ouch! Yup, a welding arc is pretty UV intense, sleeves required indeed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plank22 Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 We use brake cleaner all the time, especially for alu, its the best for removing grease. The bit I dont understand is that the smallest piece of heat and the BC evaporates off in a split second or goes bang! So I blow off with an airline before welding up. We use Wurth brake cleaner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lansalot Posted August 4, 2009 Share Posted August 4, 2009 Another warning to welders... wear long sleeved shirts!this happened about 4 weeks ago, and i now have a really odd tan line and my skin burns really easy in the sun.... not that we get much in derbyshire! Ouch! First thing my instructor told us was to keep covered up, the UV that welding emits will scorch you. It's not just about the hot sparks getting all burny - cracking sunburn happens really quickly. He also told us about the guy who was attending the college, put the MIG torch back down on the table and didn't notice the wire feed engaged. Until the red-hot tip of the wire burned straight through his trousers, underpants and gave him an extra hole in "it".... Cue a trip to casualty and much jokes about physio from a flute player who will at least teach him how to hold it correctly. (Though I'm cynical enough to admit that that tale is probably an urban myth of course ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
errol209 Posted August 4, 2009 Share Posted August 4, 2009 (Though I'm cynical enough to admit that that tale is probably an urban myth of course ) Not an urban myth (but only slightly related) is the tale of "Gimp", a trackworker of excessive shoe size in relation to his IQ. He was admitted to hospital with an itchy rash on his forearms. The doctor was puzzled to discover that the "rash" was in fact all scar tissue. More worrying was that a magnet stuck to his arm ... It transpired (under much questioning) that Gimp was in the habit of operating the 14" petrol disk cutters (used for cutting rails) without any PPE at all, and the constant shower of hot sparks landing on his arms had created the "rash" (of embedded grinder grit). It took over six months of smelly topical lotions and several visits to have his epdermis scraped before he re-emerged, pink, clean and minus most of his tattoos! (A related tale is of the two track welders, one of whom accidently played an oxy-propane cutting torch across the bald head of his mate, in the dark - you may now weep ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.