Hybrid_From_Hell Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 Hi All, Mini tech DIY Idea - write up I've bashed my BRAND NEW casing fitted only a year or so ago so bad that the case leaks at the base where the QT Guard distorted when walloped it -and another leak on the threads of the filler, which I think is distorted similarly and I tried to fix it - but failed. The LR Diff pan is notoriously thin, having cut one off is measures up at just 1.6mm so its not the strongest out there, and is prone to bashing, denting and spliting, which is a real PITFA. I have tried many diff guards over the years, many if not most I have been disappointed with, either from coming off, or not being too good in terms of protection So, I have been thinking for a while as to options - sewer pipe cover - truly strong, but I am sure that not having the "Guides" for the Crown wheel affects lubrication of oil to the pinion, also these cost Money and so I looked about. Devon 4x4 sell a ludicriously bling thing, which is out rageous money, and not my cup of tea, and I still wonder of the strength, so I thought some more, then one day at work a Toyota 4x4 Axle casing was cut up ... The diff pan looked sort of 'similar', measuring showed its bigger OD and a tad less in 'height', but a plan sort of formed in my head, especuially as it was free Cleaned up with a shot blaster it was popped on one side. Today saw me remove the Rear Axle and strip to just the casing the the old thin LR Diff pan was cut off, and linished back so no lip remained at all, giving me a wide weld prep, the height being slighly less in places meant it was tacked up with a suitable gap for Crown wheel clearnce (I Hoped) - a few pics : And some pics of the new diff pan - the LR one is 1.6mm and the toyota one is 4.2mm Then tacked it up good and proper, the diff popped back in and the pinion turned yabaa dabaa doo - all clear, then remove diff and weld it up. I welded it up twice, once just to weld it up, and the second weld around to make sure there are no gaps or pin holes, makes for a big amount of weld on it, but its no point doing this sort of mod, and finding on fitting its leaking Then a close check around and all seemed fine, so as its cold and damp I shoved some primer on it : So, with a near 5mm thick diff pan, I reckon that should be enough, without extra plating time will tell - but it a hell of a lot beffier than the poor LR Offering - the next to be beefed up will be brake lines. When you look at the pics below, its really not hard to see why brake lines get ripped off, bent or strained, I bolted a caliper to the casing added a GENUINE new pipe and fitted it, frankly its a pretty c**p routing, and so this will be next. I have seen the 10-12mm rod "Ears" added to D4x4 axle and have had some thinking on using this idea but hopefully a differing outcome which may suprise,.... thats next weekends jobbie Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heath robinson Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 I'm awaiting the next instalment with baited welder. Your timing's perfect, as I'm about to recondition my axles, and had been mulling over the devon 4x4 method. It's simple, but not all that well protected. Are these thicker pans commonly removed? If so, where might a man of my standing find one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 Dear God Almighty - I never learn After the reasonably quick conversion of Diff pans, (and after 2 days of various Megasquirt work) I had today to 'finish' my axle mods.................... - Hahahaha hahaha ha ha Bl**dy Ha About half way ........... The idea was to ensure the rear axles brake pipes and fittings are reverse and 'scrubland' proof, as I have said having to reverse in to gawd knows what as a marshal to recover stuck 4x4s, and / or driving into / out of stick / bvraches / rocks / etc type of debris and damaging brake lines and the peeling off ARB air lines etc The idea having sorted the diff pan was a quick 'brake line protector', and also to convert the normally solid brake line each side of the axle to one with a flexible hose to aid hanging up the caliper(s) when needing to do hub work, rather than the Ooooer I'll just push my luck bending this solid brake pipe etc So, started with making some loops, all of this is 12mm rod (they were out of 30mm ) - having worked out the sort of size I was after I made up a simple former and bent up some loops, these were as small as I could make but large enough to allow brake pipe and male / female brake mountings pass through them, wanted bleed screws and all nuts and bolts still get attable : Then I tried the special stainless hoses I had made up to spec, these being crimpled are road legal, but the angle of the coupler means no more hose in the air issues, this follows the line of the caliper and then follows the axle seam welded line, so I made a bracket and with a bit more fabbing the line protectors take shape : This then leaves the flexi vunerable, so with the Oxy Acet and some baending a frame was made to protect these, I have seen the D4x4 and others who have made "Wings" but I am at a loss to understand the logic of having a shaped bar ending in mid air, and there is no strength to the end part so with mine I have shaped it and taken it down to a spacer made and added to the outside caliper top mount, this will have a correspondingly longer bolt to compensate, ,,,but makes for a stronger unit IMVHO I also lathed up a piece of tube, welded to the frame so that the flexi hose shaped protector is competely removable , but the shaper is shaped to also allow access with spanners to all the nuts and mountings etc : So, half done... other side to go, ...plus the pipe to be made and mounted and the top of the axle pipe to also be protected I know many will say this is OTT and not needed, but I also know I do have an issue with rear axle pipes as others do to, so hence this is a tad 'belt and braces'. The new Braided hoses do reduce the "Stickyoutness" factor a huge amount, I'm hoping that wuith the protectors too, this will be an issue for me (and maybe otheers) of the past So far cost is minimal too More to come Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddydisco Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 Just out of intrest where did you get the braided flexi hoses from and how much were they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 £12 Think Automotive Isleworth Inc'd bolt, crush washers, hose, stainless shaped thingumy, and crimping Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 The good thing of making them out of 12 mm rod is that you can also connect a towrope to it! Daan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 :rofl: Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boothy Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Nige, Whilst you have the axle sat there on the bench it is a fantastic time to add some additional strengthening/welding to the ball joint braket, which is not the strongest of fabrications in the world in its factory finish. I have ripped a couple off or caused some quite significant distortion to them, so now is a belting time to give it a bit of additional welding and strength. Pity about spoiling the paint job though, oh and try opening your eyes next time you weld,, you get a much better finish,, top tip that,,,, Anyway off to bath the ferrets now..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 ^^^ Thats a good thought (the A Frame strengthening, not the vision of you in a bath with ferrets ) Got any pics ? (A Frame ball joint ONLY please) Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cieranc Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 I did mine a while ago, the only concern was the clearance between the diff pan and the panhard rod. shouldn't be a problem for you, as your new pan is the right shape, so the bulge for the crown-wheel is right where the bend in the rod is. I used the arse off a gas cylinder, so there was no crown wheel bulge: http://www.landroveraddict.com/smf/index.php?topic=376158.0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 Hi all I have had a few PMs now asking me about the SS Lines, costs and who from part nos etc These are "HFH" Made to order specials, but, the good news is I can give the info that will assist you to get exactly the same Rough price per side is £15 inc VAT The compant who made these for me was THINK AUTOMOTIVE, 292 Worton Road, Isleworth, Middx, TW7 6EL and yes they do do mail order I think Tel Number is 0208568 1172 PK for EACH pipe you will need : 1 x Banjo H697-03C 70 BANJO SS SWAGE 10-MM / 3 . 8 @ £3.37 1 X H669-31C M10 X 1 FIXED MALE BLKD SS SWG @ 3.37 2 X FERRULE FERSS-03 -3 TFE HOSE @ £0.84 EACH 2 X HOSE SUPPORT .31 ID .20 HOLE HSC2 @ £0.66 EACH 2 X COPPER WASHER FIXINGS WC-M10 @ £0.11 EACH 1 X BANJO BBSS2-31 M10 X 1 SS BULKHEAD NUT @ £1.71 1 X BBSS2-31 M10 X 1 BANJO BOLT SS @ £3.06 1 X 0.700 METRE TFEPVC3 TFE3 HOSE WITH CLEAR PVC PROTECT COVER £7.08 Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishbosh Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Out of interest Nige, why didn't you go flexi all the way to the T piece? I have considered moving the T piece up tot the chassis bracket and using flexi all the way to the calipers (down the a frame). Could you not weld a piece of angle to the axle case with one leg horizontal and the other vertically down, drill some holes in the legs and cable tie a flexi hose all the way across. Or are my ideas too late now...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 Out of interest Nige, why didn't you go flexi all the way to the T piece? I have considered moving the T piece up tot the chassis bracket and using flexi all the way to the calipers (down the a frame). Could you not weld a piece of angle to the axle case with one leg horizontal and the other vertically down, drill some holes in the legs and cable tie a flexi hose all the way across. Or are my ideas too late now...? Bit late Also £8 per 10" ................... 6 foot = I looked at many options, fancied being able to lift calipers up and out of the way easy rather than bend pipe so just need a short length of expensive hose and pipe and bit of fabbing = cheap Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Llama hoses, £15.50 inc VAT up to a metre in length.... Can't think that going to 2 metres would break the bank.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 F... me Nige, your brake pipes shouldn't be going anywhere! How much to do mine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_LLAMA4x4 Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Llama hoses, £15.50 inc VAT up to a metre in length.... Can't think that going to 2 metres would break the bank.... Add £ 6-8 per metre over the 1m length then knock off the 10% discount...... David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I'm going for some Llama ones from calipers to the T piece sick to death of replacing the rigid lines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heath robinson Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 Is there a sensible route from the front callipers along the axle, then up? I feel that having the things that far out means that you need too much flappy hose in order to get good articulation. Is it possible/sensible to route them a bit further in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 Long lines along the radius arms I guess. My fronts have been ok the rear have been replaced a few times and need doing again. So I am opting for the Llama ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasmic Farmer Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 For fronts I have run 1m Llama ones along the top of the radius arms. I welded some bar along there to fix it too so that it wasn't possible for the wheel to catch when on full lock. I ran the copper brake lines down to a point where they meet the hoses near to the bulkhead mounts (Disco)Even on full articulation there is only a couple of inches of movement here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heath robinson Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 I like that, it has a certain elegance to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 Follow up I contacted David Llama he is making me a set from the caliper to the T piece all parts included For nigh on £40 plus Davids come with quote: "the hoses I make would also be pvc coated with whip guards on the ends." I have had Davids flexi brake lines on the Defender for over 5 years now and they have been faultless So I am looking forward to these arriving as soon as I have paid David. I measured mine today and the lines measure 700mm and 1070mm from the face of the T piece to the caliper, David is doing 90 degree bends at the caliper so the days of ripping off copper pipes are numbered! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moose Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 I measured mine today and the lines measure 700mm and 1070mm from the face of the T piece to the caliper, David is doing 90 degree bends at the caliper so the days of ripping off copper pipes are numbered! prob for another thread but do post up some images of the end result as thinking about doing the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_LLAMA4x4 Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 I like that, it has a certain elegance to it. The ones QT have from me for their 3-link kits do this but continue in braid all the way from the usual mountings on the axle and chassis.... they then route them up the arm and back across the chassis and no further modification to any piping is required.... Another way I like is to go the Toyota ( 101's were the same ) route of having a hose dropping down to the diff and splitting across the axle with little jump hoses around the swivels. This ends up being similar to the rear which is far better protected than the front..... Having said that Tomcat order their hoses to be the same in all four corners dropping from the chassis and straight into the calipers with a banjo - perhaps for racing they are less likely to get ripped off on logs etc and this does have the advantage of making one spare fit all corners.... Gwyn Lewis uses all the std mounting locations BUT what Gwyn has done with the hoses he orders is to very carefully ascertain the correct length - long enough to reach even the extreme articultion of his challenge kit but not so long that they catch or rub. This is I am sure why despite being 'only standard mounting' you never hear of problems with hoses on his suspension setup as long as you have the hoses from himand don't just guess that some Britpart +4" will do nicely... There are I am sure endless other options but I just do as I am told and make the hoses people ask for David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted March 15, 2010 Author Share Posted March 15, 2010 Bit more of an update. Now finished the final 2 x protectors between the sides, going up and across the top of the New Diff Pan, new brake lines are all made, and fit (Just) welded everything up cut off the silly cups top and bottom of the bottom shocker mounting on the casing (I think they lock up and hold back on articulation) bit of fettling, and some paint I lso found that the rear springs seats had got squashed and bent, so have beefed these on both sides with some 6mm plate - drilled holes etc that should sort them out . The 2 x top protectors are also removeable just like the ones down by the Hoses. Now I have an axle about to go back on, diffs back in and onto the 90 more later And thats the entire day gone - ....again Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.