Winch or rear locker??

[Bull Bar Cowboy]

Tony,

Yes, it came out really well ………. but I don’t want to hijack steves thread

Caproni pump, maxidrive PTO, Manual spool, in cab pressure gauge …….. its been done her before so I posted it here,

Winch build

But if you feel there will be interest I can also post on here

Thankyou Steve ……….. sorry

Ian

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

Ian,

Shame on you for posting on "the Darkside" and not here

Repost it here too !

Nige

[Andy]

winch first then lockers. as said above, at least you can normally get yourself out of trouble then.

i dont see the need for uprated shafts etc unless your running huge fancy tyres, normally the only way you'd break stuff 'due' to a locker is bad driving. if anything lockers prevent breakages as you dont get lifted wheels spinning so much *takes cover*

re: tru-trac V locker - they dont do the same thing, lift a wheel with a tru-trac & it'll have a habit of acting like an open diff where as lift a wheel with a locker & the other will still drive.

tru-tracs are great in the front, dont really effect steering but add loads of grip as you crawl over stuff.

[02GF74]

SteveG,

What is your planned use for the LR? Tesco carpark, green laning alone/in a group, Billing off-road course, trials, events etc:

Knowing which one(s) would help.

[jules]

A winch will 99 times out of 100 get you out

A locker will not always get you through and when your stuck your bu88ered

[Tonk]

if u plan to have all 4 when u've finished, i'd go, front winch, rear locker, rear winch then front locker

[Michele]

And where's Michele with the toy centre option?

What would you recomend for the rear Michele and how does it stack up price wise? I'd be open to converting my rear (oh err missus) to toy and moving the ARB to the front if in the beardy man's terms it gives me VFM.

Sorry I just read the thread this morning and was about to add my coin.

Winch:100 times before the locker if you're out there alone as most of the time I do.

I found it so useful since the beginning and got unstuck where I should have walked back home and steal dad's tractor to recovery the Cube if I had not fitted one.

Locker,yeah,it gives traction,but it's not granted it saves the day as a winch does.

Comp bits for the winch:if you have the money,or if it's just for the sake of it,lucky you.

Anyway I am still with no double batteries setup ($$$$) and I survived so far.

In the meanwhile I successfully managed to rescue a friend's truck last winter

(see my thread with pics).

Yup I stalled my 8274 recently but it was more due to lazyness than to the winch itself.

As to the Toy CVs;I drive and steer with locker engaged with no fuss.

I am not a wrecker and I am always gentle with my truck,or I try my best,

but the Longs have been widely abused and didn't batt an eyelid.

Diff conversion (full Toy route);if I had to get back (before ARBs) I would be tempted.

I think many forumeers could allow the non-running time and have the job made "in house" unlike me,

which is the main reason to stop me eventually,the Cube is my DD and I have no room/tools at home to do the job.

My thoughs.

[SteveG]

What is your planned use for the LR? Tesco carpark, green laning alone/in a group, Billing off-road course, trials, events etc:

Knowing which one(s) would help.

All bar the Billing off-road course Does that help :rolleyes: Intrigued to know what I need for Tesco's car park though

Interesting to see the different opinions of everyone. So the reason for my dilema, apart from funds - otherwise I'd have both is really due to the fact apart from Winch challenges the winch got used far less than lockers.

I do lots of solo laning, but frankly round here I haven't met anything that a spade, Hi-Lift and a pair of waffles can't get you out of. Now if I was solo laning in Wales I would change my mind.

Play days - it's my view that I'm going to get more out of a rear locker at these than a winch as there are usually enough people around who can give you a tug out if you get stuck. A number of climbs at play day sites are not possible without a rear locker.

Although at sites like Bampton and Rusper you're going to have more fun with a winch. At the end of Tony's Birthady Bash last year you wouldn't have got back to the entrance from the far side of the site without a winch.

Trials, hardly ever do them, but I know enough to know that a winch is useless here 3-Link, and lockers helped at last years Belgium National - except when I forgot to turn the rear off once or twice and understeered into the tape!!

Winch Challenges - well that's obvious Although James, JST makes a good point about fitting winch first means I can stay in Std class.

As for modding the 8274 drum, I thought about Jim's free spool drum, but decided to leave alone - especially after I totted up the cost of everything else!! As for longer drum I already have an extension rope + 35m main rope in the garage.

As ian, Bull Bar Cowboy, says I'll probably toss a coin

Cheers for all points so far and no problem with post hijacking for interesting stuff

Steve

[will_warne]

But why put on a bigger drum. The only time you need a bigger drum is if you do what Jez does. If you don't it's a pointless waste of money. If you winch in places with few anchor points you use extensions, because putting more layers on a drum just makes the damn thing less efficient unless it is hydraulic. And why keep the 8274 when low load speed is not of the essence, why not concentrate on VFM?

Why should a locker cause more 'strain on the train' unless you are using it for a purpose not intended. So you can't turn corners with a front locker in - live with it. Use the winch instead or fit an LSD. Constantly beefing up the drive train just hides poor planning and poor driving practice - sorry to say it but that's the fact.

Again, why should suspension take time? It's simple. Make it strong, make it reliable, make it do the job as best as possible, make it VFM, keep your CoG low and your flex high and make it easy to fix. Nuff said

Dave; big, small diameter drum with 125 - 150 ft of cable means few layers so higher absolute pull, therefore motor spins faster with a lower current draw for a given load. Therefore the winch actually pulls faster and has a higher duty cycle than the standard drummed winch with a simerlar length of cable. Getting more cable onto the drum isn't the point here.

True, Dave. In many cases there will be less strain on the drivetrain as you won't have tyres spinning so much but I found few people who've broken less shafts with lockers fitted. You can still steer with lockers fitted, you just need to get the setup right. Popping the front locker in and turning from lock to lock while feathering the throttle to hunt for grip works very, very well. However, if you do this with standard CVs you will end up with a mess inside at least one of your swivels.

There are many times when you've got no grip, as Tony mentioned, where no ammount of power, large knobbly tyres or lockers will get you through meaning you have to winch. Also, when the going gets tough everyone has to winch which is why its such a useful tool!

The reason suspension will take time is that, if you're going as far as 3-link, you're not doing an 'off the shelf' mod and there's likely to be a certain ammount of fabrication and trial and error involved. If you've got to drive the vehicle to work on Monday morning the longest job you can really do is a 2 day one. Yes, it will help a lot off road but its a lot of work. Just talk to Nigel Barker....

[white90]

another point to ask may be what people actually have

then what they'd recommend

[Michele]

I do lots of solo laning, but frankly round here I haven't met anything that a spade, Hi-Lift and a pair of waffles can't get you out of

The Jackall in the back helped a couple of times indeed,but...

This has always been amongst my favourite web readings,since I got my first 90;

A lot of people ask me about aftermarket accessories and what should be the first few items to make their rig unstoppable. I mention the things I wrote about in Part I and a winch. I get the normally asked questions about "lockers," big tires, suspensions, big engines, etc. I would rather see a winch go on first than lockers et al. THE WINCH WILL ALWAYS GET YOU OUT, the other things will always get you stuck! If you don't have a way to get unstuck, then what good are all those fancy traction devices and all the power in the world? Stuck is stuck is stuck!

from this article

In reply to Tony I got the winch first,then lockers,and this is what I'd recommend.

Each to his own in the end.

A 3-link kit has been ordered BTW as "test product" (...),

I am supposed to try it on my truck but we'll see what in the future...

[JST]

Steve,

IF you go winch way a call to David may save some cash on bumper design, depending on what type you want. Tony C has one fitted to his if you are ensure on spec etc. Daves prob doing the rounds at Billing etc.