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Show me your power steering setups


Chicken Drumstick
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i think someone did it by passing the bottom of the box through the steering relay hole. cant remember where i saw it, but it seemed a smart solution and would be ideal for someone like me who has a galvy chassis and welding to it will comprimise the protection. the welding was minimal IIRC

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I've heard of using the p38 box. It's smaller than the 90 one isn't it?

What bits would I need, a 90 column, p38 box.

Some way of attaching the box, some way of supporting the column and then joining them together and some way of connecting the pitman arm to the steering arm.

Anyone know of a guide for doing this?

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If you go beyond Defender/RRC/Disco 1 bits it becomes more complex, for example the D2 box has different splines on the input and a different arm. The P38 box mounts differently (outside the chassis IIRC). You may find steering bars don't line up or TRE's don't fit. If you have to ask and all that...

Easiest would be all Defender bits, then you know how it all goes together and can measure a standard truck. Supporting the column you will have to brace it to the bulkhead mount, you can see that in my piccy.

"Some way of attaching the box" you'll have to cut & weld (and weld properly and safely, it MUST be strong) the mounting including crush tubes through the chassis, the mount takes HUGE loads.

If you have ANY doubt about this do not do it or ask someone qualified, you do NOT want to be driving along the road and have no steering :o or indeed have to explain your welding to the judge / bereaved family.

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Thanks. I won't be doing this personally. Just trying to gather all the required info together so the people doing the work have something to base it on, rather than trying to reinvent the wheel, as it were.

Have found a guide for using the p38 box. Not sure about it going on the outside of the chassis though. As I'd want to make sure I could get as much steering lock as possible and I don't know if this would get in the way.

http://www.expeditionlandrover.info/PowerSteering.htm

Image1162.jpg

I wonder if a LHD p38a pump would mount ok on the inside of the chassis rail, would need to have a look at how much space there is or isn't.

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have a look in my thread on the 80" I fitted it inboard, does require quite some modding to the chassis though. But a much neater solution IMO. But whichever way you choose to fit it, I'll highly recommend the p38 box. Both better and smaller than a defender unit.

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I have fitted a P38 system to my 2a.

Mine is a RHD set up which appears very similar to the LHD picture above, I used a slightly more convoluted 10mm plate welded to the outside of the chassis to increase the welded surface area. The bolt pattern of the P38 box positions them above and below the chassis allowing tubes to be welded to the top and bottom and boxed in. There are some pictures of the initial build in my profile. I wanted to avoid cutting into the chassis as I wanted to keep the original front cross-member and dumb ions without modification.

The parts used were disco 1 steering column (with the bell end cut off) , unmodified P38 intermediate shaft (Splines fit the disco 1 column), RHD P38 steering box, steering drag link made from series HD solid bar turned down to interference fit inside P38 drag link plug welded along its length, a pair of hydraulic pipes made up by my local agricultural engineers. Ignore the steering bar in the pictures that was just 2 welded together to check the operation in the garage.

The series has now been on the road for a couple of months and the P38 box gives excellent steering without any of the series wander and I have had no issues with the tyres contacting the box on the outside of the chassis. I run standard width axles with 235/85`s on modular wheels.

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I've been running a P38 box for the past 18 months and would highly recomend it.

I had a 6mm plate cut to mount the box to. This plate is welded to, and also bolted through the chassis (with crush tubes welded inside the chassis rail). The box then bolts to the plate.

I did the conversion alongside a 200tdi conversion so the pump was taken care of from that.

I have used a top column from an early 110, I cut away the series bracketry and simply extended the defender bottom bearing bracket to suit my chosen driving position.

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My mid shaft is from a 200tdi Discovery fitted with the p38 lower UJ (not shown in the below photograph) it's important that you use the P38 UJ as the splines on the box are not the same as the adwest type boxes.

I shortened a spare track rod to make my steering bar, you will need a 5/8 drill and 11/16 x 16tpi UNS taps. My pipes were made up by a local agricultural hydraulics company, the p38 box unions are banjos one is M14 x 1.5, the other M16 x 1.5.

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I'm running 235/85R16's on 8 spokes and they don't hit at all, I've also tried a 7.50R16 on a standard rim and that didn't come close to contact either.

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Have you read this thread CD?

http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=88182&page=2

Might have some good info in there :)

Josh

Thanks. Think I'd read that before, but couldn't remember where. Glad you posted it up :D

However on this note, these pics from that thread:

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There doesn't seem to be a huge amount of steering lock. The tyre is no way near the spring. And the rims don't look that offset.

I assume the only way to get more lock would be to use a longer pitman arm (increased throw?).

Does anyone know if there are any longer pitman arms you can use on the p38 box?

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For better illustration. here's a couple of pics from my setup. As you can clearly see from the paint scraped off the chassis there is no way to have the steering box on the outside for me, and also this indicates the sort of steering lock I have:

I personally didn't want to have my hands tied as to what tyres and wheels I could fit, especially seeing as mine is a S1 the body is narrower.

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post-9137-0-77705300-1431529413_thumb.jpg

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I'm only on 7.50's with this vehicle. And no real intention to run anything much bigger. Might go 235/85 as 7.50 choice is a bit limited or maybe a 255/85, but nothing wide or taller. My 'other' Landy has the bigger wheels, or least it will when it's finished.

bigger will touch the chassis I assume? (my 7.5's already touch the chassis on a hard right turn (on the right side)

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For better illustration. here's a couple of pics from my setup. As you can clearly see from the paint scraped off the chassis there is no way to have the steering box on the outside for me, and also this indicates the sort of steering lock I have:

I personally didn't want to have my hands tied as to what tyres and wheels I could fit, especially seeing as mine is a S1 the body is narrower.

are the wheels mounted 'the other way around' for getting more steering room and widening the track?

As written in previous post I have the same scraping at the back of the right frontwheel runnin 7.5" on my 1980 series III 109.

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Moving the wheels out will allow more lock before they rub the chassis. If you go with bigger, i.e. wider wheels, then you can only move them out so far before they rub on the outside of the arch and/or stick out.

Also wider means the inner edge is usually tucked in more, even if the outer sticks out.

Taller, this affects steering because if you measure from the hub centre to the chassis on full lock, there will be 'x' distance. The larger the tyre the more room it'll need before it hits the chassis.

In terms of your setup, what rims are you running? You may find simply swapping to some different rims, or adding a wheel spacer will solve your issue.

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Hehe I can see now how my wheel fitment on the pics might seem confusing, bt make no mistake I never drive with my wheels fitted like that, it is purely because it makes it easier to work on the car as I can stand between the chassis and wheel. As said earlier I cannot run wheels with greater offset or spacers for that matter, because of the narrow S1 chassis. On the right rims I can just barely squeeze a 33" x 12,5" under there, which isn't all that easy on a S2 or 3 let alone a S1! But of course not everyone needs to run bigger tyres than 235s, I just felt like I would probably regret it if I limited myself to that. And so far I have been right, when we drive in the more loose tracks I love my 33"s

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  • 2 weeks later...

I never really thought much about PAS on mine until yeaterday, my argument against was not wanting to compromise my galv chassis protection.

I have, however become increasingly bored of the amount of effort it takes to complete a tight 3 point turn etc, or if anyone else drives it it becomes a PITA.

I never really looked at how to do it in detail, assuming it would be a relatively involved job, but today I bit the bullet and purchased a P38a box off ebay.

I was going to do the "no chassis mod" through relay hole type conversion but my rad is in the way (200TDi rad) and therefore I can't. ive decided to mount a folded steel spreader plate to the outside of the chassis which will also spread the load over the top and bottom faces of the chassis rail. I wont be fitting crush tubes I will be mounting directly to the (substantial) plate.

I will complete a set of load cases and FEA on the bracket to determine a FOS and fatigue life estimation to back up my work.

I've picked up a PAS pump off a 200TDi defender for free, and i'm now collecting bits. so far the overall cost is £60 for the box. In my mind that is so cheap for a box which is regarded much more highly than the earlier (more leaky more wandery) steering boxes, this one has a 90 day warranty too.

i'm hoping to spend around £150 or less all in. just need to find a steering column upper and lower now.

I will post my progress in my truck's thread, and link it to here. I wont get started until after the 3rd at the earliest though

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Hehe I can see now how my wheel fitment on the pics might seem confusing, bt make no mistake I never drive with my wheels fitted like that, it is purely because it makes it easier to work on the car as I can stand between the chassis and wheel. As said earlier I cannot run wheels with greater offset or spacers for that matter, because of the narrow S1 chassis. On the right rims I can just barely squeeze a 33" x 12,5" under there, which isn't all that easy on a S2 or 3 let alone a S1! But of course not everyone needs to run bigger tyres than 235s, I just felt like I would probably regret it if I limited myself to that. And so far I have been right, when we drive in the more loose tracks I love my 33"s

Sorry, how do you mean the chassis is narrower?

All the series 1s I've worked on have had the same width chassis as the rest of the chassied LR vehicles, and the cabs are actually bigger than the series 2, 3 and defeners.

The narrowest LR chassis is the Lightweight, and all that they did to that was lop a bit of the riggers.

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