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OT Perkins A3.152 Run dry of water

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Sorry this is a little off topic - the engine in question is the early indirect injection version fitted to a Fordson Dexta tractor (I did pick it up with the Landy)

The previous owner allowed it to run dry of coolant due to a radiator leak and continued to use it until in his words 'it went boom' I was expecting the tractor to have some fairly obvious signs of head gasket failure or worse from being overheated.

I filled it up with water and It starts up and runs well, sounds normal. I did a compression test and got figures of 300psi on two cylinders and 340psi on the third. This seems fairly normal I would think?

The issue is that it is breathing very badly from the rocker cover breather pipe, once it starts to warm up it appears that there is steam coming out of the breather. There is no evidence of water in the oil but I guess this issue has just happened as he stopped using it as soon as he had a problem.

Had the rocker cover off and all looks good in there. I guess I am going to have to have the head off to investigate further, what are peoples thoughts to what is causing this? Head gasket? cracked head? or worst case slipped dry liner?

 

 

 

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The rings may have picked up on the liner.  Lift the head and look for vertical scoring down the bore.  I had this happen to a Perkins 4203.

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14 minutes ago, rtbarton said:

The rings may have picked up on the liner.  Lift the head and look for vertical scoring down the bore.  I had this happen to a Perkins 4203.

I think head off has to be the next thing to do - why would I be getting steam from the breather though?

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I guess that would be due to damaged head gasket.  Is there a smell to the fumes/steam?  If you can smell aluminium then IME that would be piston/bore damage, in any event, the head's got to come off.. 

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Smoke from the rocker (from blowby) can quite often look like steam, as above, try the sniff test and see.

Nice little power unit :)

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52 minutes ago, rtbarton said:

I guess that would be due to damaged head gasket.  Is there a smell to the fumes/steam?  If you can smell aluminium then IME that would be piston/bore damage, in any event, the head's got to come off.. 

No it does not seem to smell, I have been laying next to the tractor smelling it like a weirdo all weekend!!

 

40 minutes ago, Bowie69 said:

Smoke from the rocker (from blowby) can quite often look like steam, as above, try the sniff test and see.

Nice little power unit :)

What I am confused about is why are my compression test numbers decent with this much blowby?

 

They are excellent little engines though - We also have 2 Massey 135's with the later direct injection version of this engine and they never cause any problems and start in any temperature with no heat

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The pressures you are measuring are due to the pistons compressing air at low revs, once you get the engine running I reckon the pressure will be 10 times your measured pressure, so a lot of gas will blow through a relatively small hole.

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Well i must say 1960's Fordsons are easier to work on than TDV8 Range Rovers! Head off easily in less than an hour and a half. Its a copper gasket so its not so easy to spot if it has blown. 

 

On the plus side all three bores look good with no scoring. 

Pictures.... What do people think? 

 

DSC_1307.thumb.JPG.a2c8da2b2de60a54a9a28d9a8dd2c606.JPGDSC_1309.thumb.JPG.71ec463fceb460fbb904256f3467acc4.JPGDSC_1308.thumb.JPG.aeb6e7f371dfb90e84e7efb12c0b156e.JPG

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Top cylinder in first pic, and right cylinder in middle pic look like could have been blowing into triangular water port?

These old engine are lovely to work on, headgasket changed in 2.5 hours on an A series, as a recent example. Plus, not being a land rover, everything weighs half of what you expect! Not sure about the last bit on your engine though ;)

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2 hours ago, Bowie69 said:

Top cylinder in first pic, and right cylinder in middle pic look like could have been blowing into triangular water port?

Agreed  - that is the only thing that looks possible. I didn't want to put words in peoples mouths though!

I think it would be sensible to get the head pressure tested as well as skimmed

 

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Get them to check for flatness first (or do it yourself), much cheaper than a skim!

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How daft to run it without water.  Was water too expensive? The 'boom' is slightly worrying though.If possible I'd inspect the bores really carefully, it could have picked up or cracked between the bores

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looks blown to me...

 

se circled areas in the pics....

1.jpg.6f53ec717c45e1f6ccea5d2ff9228734.jpg

2.jpg.fe3ece4896116f181bdaa4461cd1b676.jpg

3.jpg.f0ba8036092347f3118f08ab78dfd674.jpg

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16 hours ago, cackshifter said:

How daft to run it without water.  Was water too expensive? The 'boom' is slightly worrying though.If possible I'd inspect the bores really carefully, it could have picked up or cracked between the bores

I think he knew there was a bit of a leak but had not realised how bad/that all the water had run out. That's a fair point and I can easily check closely now the head is off  - they are liners so cracking is possible

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16 hours ago, qwakers said:

looks blown to me...

 

se circled areas in the pics....

 

 

 

that's what I am hoping

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