LEZ (the old one not the new ULEZ)

[western]

7 hours ago, shagger said:

Hi. Bought this one, a 1993, my first, a couple of weeks ago....all fine until a couple of days ago when I received 2 penalty charges for driving on Croydon Road, Mitcham. SW London... a Low Emissions Zone... £250 each if I pay within 14 days...£750 each if I dont !!! anyone else had this ? I seem to own a car that I can't drive ... what fun !

Since posting this, I got another one today, same spot ....... I now have to avoid that particular area !

I had a long chat with the guys I bought the Landy from, and they reckon that they can assist, by getting the classification amended with DVLA and presumably TFL as well, to record that it has 4 fixed seats and belts in the back, which, backed up with pics of the outside and inside,  I am hoping like hell, will solve my problem.

If it does not do the trick, then I and I guess many other Landrover owners are well and truly buggered.

looking at that side view, the side windows are not Genuine LR, the sliding pane lock should be forward not at the rear, reckon its a converted hardtop or a pick up made into a station wagon, if it was Factory built as a station wagon it should have the M in VIN.

[smallfry]

1 hour ago, western said:

looking at that side view, the side windows are not Genuine LR, the sliding pane lock should be forward not at the rear, reckon its a converted hardtop or a pick up made into a station wagon, if it was Factory built as a station wagon it should have the M in VIN.

It also has a ribbed roof, which it shouldnt have at that age

Mine is LEZ exempt, and it has "M1" in the vehicle type approval box on the V5, making it a car and not a commercial.

[Steve King]

On 5/30/2021 at 6:36 PM, reb78 said:

Just looked at my V5 - it says County but not station wagon anywhere. The county pack could only be added to station wagons couldn't it?

 

it is registered as an estate though!

Whats the VIN code for a station wagon? I seem to remember one or a set of the letters indicated an SW?

No the County spec was available for hardtops too! 
 

 

[Nonimouse]

Why are station wagons exempt (sometimes)

[reb78]

5 minutes ago, Nonimouse said:

Why are station wagons exempt (sometimes)

They class them as cars not vans. Emissions are exactly the same though! 
 

Mine is a genuine CSW (I have the original receipt) with an M in the right place in the VIN and Estate on the V5. They (TFL) did something in March which removed my previous exemption which is ridiculous because nothing has changed with the car so overnight I would have had to pay the charge. I spend a lot of time just north of the LEZ boundary so will easily go I to it. The 110 is parked up for a chassis change so not in use currently so I haven't been caught but I now need to register it with them along with photos. 
 

That idiot mayor is changing things again in October though as the ULEZ is expanding so I will wait until then to register as I think things will all change again. 
 

No thought has been given to people with little money inside these zones - I have family who struggle financially at times who will be affected by these changes. They simply cant afford to scrap and replace their old, non compliant, vehicles so the 'mayor of the people' forces locals out or onto the breadline further ... great move. 

[Nonimouse]

If you read the list of the city's that are becoming CAZ's in the very near future, it's a bit of a concern. My T4 is a Caravelle - so classed as a minibus - that's going to be £9 to got Exeter, Bristol or Bath and up to £50 for some other cities. I won't be visiting London in the Disco or the Dub (not that I go there anyway). I had no intention of going to Portsmouth, but if I did...

And what does it achieve?

The Bath thing is a blessed nightmare. The A36 (High-speed Trunk Road) runs through bath and was a major route for the heavies going down to the coast. There's no bypass, so they now drop down the A4 and onto the A363 to Bradford Upon Avon (not a good place to take a heavy) to then try a selection of B roads to cut back onto the A36 ot A361. It's become a drivers nightmare, far more pollution, due to constant gear changes, drivers hours wrecked and longer journeys. How many of the CAZ's are going to do the same thing? 

 

[reb78]

1 minute ago, Nonimouse said:

If you read the list of the city's that are becoming CAZ's in the very near future, it's a bit of a concern. My T4 is a Caravelle - so classed as a minibus - that's going to be £9 to got Exeter, Bristol or Bath and up to £50 for some other cities. I won't be visiting London in the Disco or the Dub (not that I go there anyway). I had no intention of going to Portsmouth, but if I did...

And what does it achieve?

The Bath thing is a blessed nightmare. The A36 (High-speed Trunk Road) runs through bath and was a major route for the heavies going down to the coast. There's no bypass, so they now drop down the A4 and onto the A363 to Bradford Upon Avon (not a good place to take a heavy) to then try a selection of B roads to cut back onto the A36 ot A361. It's become a drivers nightmare, far more pollution, due to constant gear changes, drivers hours wrecked and longer journeys. How many of the CAZ's are going to do the same thing? 

 

It will end up the same with the M25 around London. I think around the Romford area, if you come off of the motorway and go inside the ring of the M25 you risk unknowingly going into the LEZ - if the prices rise or the compliant cars suddenly change it will catch a lot of people out. What you describe though causes big detours and a massive increase in emissions so it achieves the opposite of what was intended really albeit NIMBY from the point of view of those cities...

[Junglie]

On 10/5/2021 at 2:22 PM, shagger said:

Hi. Bought this one, a 1993, my first, a couple of weeks ago....all fine until a couple of days ago when I received 2 penalty charges for driving on Croydon Road, Mitcham. SW London... a Low Emissions Zone... £250 each if I pay within 14 days...£750 each if I dont !!! anyone else had this ? I seem to own a car that I can't drive ... what fun !

Since posting this, I got another one today, same spot ....... I now have to avoid that particular area !

I had a long chat with the guys I bought the Landy from, and they reckon that they can assist, by getting the classification amended with DVLA and presumably TFL as well, to record that it has 4 fixed seats and belts in the back, which, backed up with pics of the outside and inside,  I am hoping like hell, will solve my problem.

If it does not do the trick, then I and I guess many other Landrover owners are well and truly buggered.

 

I'm with you - it's why I am converting mine to a V8 at this moment.

 

But if you contact TFL with photographic evidence that it has rear seats and seatbelts, ideally with an engineer's report stating that it is safe as a passenger vehicle (but your MOT may suffice) then they can, at their discretion, exempt it.

You can't change the type with DVLA though.

Hope that helps,

 

[Lightning]

The trouble is, these Land Rovers are exactly the type of older, higher polluting vehicle that the govt wants to ban, so we are on the losing side really.

Hopefully if travelling on holiday in my 110 SW l will be able to use the bypass around some of these towns without incurring charges.

 

[smallfry]

4 hours ago, Lightning said:

The trouble is, these Land Rovers are exactly the type of older, higher polluting vehicle that the govt wants to ban, so we are on the losing side really.

Hopefully if travelling on holiday in my 110 SW l will be able to use the bypass around some of these towns without incurring charges.

 

This is true. The way things are going though, one will have to keep their wits about them, as the goalposts seem to be moving quickly.

[shagger]

5 hours ago, Lightning said:

The trouble is, these Land Rovers are exactly the type of older, higher polluting vehicle that the govt wants to ban, so we are on the losing side really.

Hopefully if travelling on holiday in my 110 SW l will be able to use the bypass around some of these towns without incurring charges.

 

i think you're right. i'm currently sneaking around back road and the like to avoid the dreaded cameras

[shagger]

21 hours ago, Junglie said:

I'm with you - it's why I am converting mine to a V8 at this moment.

 

But if you contact TFL with photographic evidence that it has rear seats and seatbelts, ideally with an engineer's report stating that it is safe as a passenger vehicle (but your MOT may suffice) then they can, at their discretion, exempt it.

You can't change the type with DVLA though.

Hope that helps,

 

Going through this process at the moment......awating the fitting of 2 of the four missing rear seats, so that we can get the pics done and submit to DVLA. Getting it through TFL MIGHT be a different story..... we shall see

[shagger]

On 10/5/2021 at 5:13 PM, Daan said:

If you own a TDCI, you can do this: https://www.cybrand.co.uk/defender

no good for a 1993 Defender 90...... i spoke with them earlier.

[shagger]

On 10/5/2021 at 6:34 PM, rusty_wingnut said:

Weirdly, mine is still exempt, as is my Dads. Both are original 110 SW/CSW. 

mmmmm thats strange. The mystery deepens

[Snagger]

I rarely drove into any cities before I left the country, and obviously haven’t driven into any UK cities at all since, so I’m not up to speed on the matter.  What is the difference between LEZs and ULEZs, from a qualification perspective?  My understanding is that all ICE vehicles other than those specifically exempted (emergency services, Crown vehicles and such) would be penalised in ULEZs, but that the LEZ charges only apply to diesel commercial vehicles that don’t meet certain emissions standards (Euro 5, I think),meaning vehicles registered as cars would be safe from LEZ charges, as would former commercial vehicles that have been redesignated “historic”, like many Series and some early coiler LRs. Is that about right?

[reb78]

45 minutes ago, Snagger said:

I rarely drove into any cities before I left the country, and obviously haven’t driven into any UK cities at all since, so I’m not up to speed on the matter.  What is the difference between LEZs and ULEZs, from a qualification perspective?  My understanding is that all ICE vehicles other than those specifically exempted (emergency services, Crown vehicles and such) would be penalised in ULEZs, but that the LEZ charges only apply to diesel commercial vehicles that don’t meet certain emissions standards (Euro 5, I think),meaning vehicles registered as cars would be safe from LEZ charges, as would former commercial vehicles that have been redesignated “historic”, like many Series and some early coiler LRs. Is that about right?

Well, it should be right but TFL (led by Man of the People Khan) keep changing the goalposts and f&cking it up properly in the process. Nothing has changed with my 110. It was exempt and by their own rules still should be but it no longer shows as so on their checker. 

Edited October 9, 2021 by reb78

[Lightning]

That means you'll get fined if you take it in to the LEZ/ULEZ

lf you plan on driving the Defender in London, l would sort out the discrepancy before you do so, rather than trying after you receive the fine.

One reason being, you only have two weeks to pay it, after that it increased threefold 

So if you get the £250 one you could end up owing £750

And it may well take more than two weeks to even start the appeals process, which there is no guarantee you would win.

[reb78]

2 minutes ago, Lightning said:

That means you'll get fined if you take it in to the LEZ/ULEZ

lf you plan on driving the Defender in London, l would sort out the discrepancy before you do so, rather than trying after you receive the fine.

One reason being, you only have two weeks to pay it, after that it increased threefold 

So if you get the £250 one you could end up owing £750

And it may well take more than two weeks to even start the appeals process, which there is no guarantee you would win.

Oh, I know. Its off the road for a chassis change currently so no risk of a fine. Things are changing again in late October so I am going to see what I need to do then rather than waste time now. I believe the ULEZ is moving out as far as the north and south circular but the monkeys at TFL probably think thats the M25 so I expect there will be a few months of havoc caused for all. 

[shagger]

has anyone tried as yet to speak to anyone at TFL? i fear that their views will be depressing for Defender 90 owners

[CwazyWabbit]

On 10/25/2021 at 2:01 PM, shagger said:

has anyone tried as yet to speak to anyone at TFL? i fear that their views will be depressing for Defender 90 owners

I spoke to them on the 1st of June as my V5 does actually have a body type of estate on it, I was advised to email them a copy of my V5 and explain that I should be exempt. On the 29th of November I received confirmation that my 110 indeed exempt from the LEZ and the checker has been updated. So it looks like the process does work but takes 6 months. Hope this helps.