Small 3D scanner?

[Bowie69]

Did I slip into a non-Land Rover forum by accident? 

 

 

 

[landroversforever]

With a camera and a ring light Ben's either starting an onlyfans or he's doing makeup tutorials  

[elbekko]

Just now, landroversforever said:

Ben's either starting an onlyfans

Ain't nobody that wants to see that.

4 minutes ago, Bowie69 said:

Did I slip into a non-Land Rover forum by accident? 

 

 

 

What, too modern?

[Bowie69]

Not too modern for me.... Just not exactly what you call normal for most LR users

 

[elbekko]

True. Good thing I'm not normal then

To be fair I've been getting similar reactions on MBWorld, but in the other direction Guess I'm not a normal Merc user either...

[SteveG]

Might be worth trying the matte spray that folks like retropower use. Can you use the stick on reference dots too with your software?

 

I see that P38’s still rust badly in the wheel well 😉😉😉😉😉…

[elbekko]

50 minutes ago, SteveG said:

Might be worth trying the matte spray that folks like retropower use. Can you use the stick on reference dots too with your software?

Yeah, I bought some of the spray, but haven't used it yet. Would probably help, didn't have much time to screw around with it yesterday.
It can work with the dots, but that seems to be a different scan mode. Haven't tried that yet.

[Bowie69]

Apparently that spray is just dry shampoo stuff, or plain talc out of the bottle works just as well (which is what dry shampoo is).

[landroversforever]

Anything to dull the shiny surface helps. Done it with dye-pen testing chalky paint in a bind before. 

[FridgeFreezer]

The results look pretty good - the real test for me would be to compare a few measurements from the software on the real car to see if you're getting accurate results, not just pictures that look like the thing you scanned?

Not doubting it - just want to know how it comes out because the obvious use-case is scanning things so you can make other things fit them, so if the dims are wonky it's a non-starter.

[elbekko]

53 minutes ago, FridgeFreezer said:

The results look pretty good - the real test for me would be to compare a few measurements from the software on the real car to see if you're getting accurate results, not just pictures that look like the thing you scanned?

Not doubting it - just want to know how it comes out because the obvious use-case is scanning things so you can make other things fit them, so if the dims are wonky it's a non-starter.

That's my next step, yes. Making for Motorsport did a test with a 1-2-3 block and came in at <0.5mm error IIRC.

[simonr]

The results look good.  I would also be interested to see what kind of measurement accuracy it delivers.

It's worth trying with an object you can scan all the way around to see if the scan at the end lines up with that at the start.  That's a good test of the cumulative accuracy.

Hairspray works quite well for matting down surfaces.  You can get chalk spray which is better, but more expensive.

Your scanner appears to cope with shiny surfaces a lot better than the einscan - but the more help you can give it, the better the results.

I do use retroflective location markers too - but they are surprisingly expensive & you can eat a whole lot of them! 

I drew & printed a load of these https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5787919/files

If you insert a magnet and cover the sides with marker dots, you can scatter them over something you're scanning - but re-use them again & again.

[elbekko]

Well, erm, wow. I did some reading of the manual (ludicrous, I know), and instead of doing the auto-processing, I set it to manual and set the resolution to max (same scan, just different processing).

This is the result. So much more detail!

It shows the thickness of the chassis here at 3.2mm, which is probably not far off.

More later.

[landroversforever]

That’s impressive! Interested to see how the measurements stack up to real life measurements.

[De Ranged]

On 3/7/2024 at 10:38 PM, Bowie69 said:

Apparently that spray is just dry shampoo stuff, or plain talc out of the bottle works just as well (which is what dry shampoo is).

 

On 3/7/2024 at 10:41 PM, landroversforever said:

Anything to dull the shiny surface helps. Done it with dye-pen testing chalky paint in a bind before. 

Thats good to know I wasn't able to buy the spray.... dangerous goods so can't be air freighted, I did find a 3D printer place in Auckland that is selling it.... $100 a can plus dangerous goods courier lol so probably cost me $160 (80Pound!). I was going to try a light dusting of matt white spray paint and then wipe it off with gun cleaner 

 

 

28 minutes ago, elbekko said:

This is the result. So much more detail!

The top one is really good! The body detail is spot on, you could design to shape and style lines from that without issue. The bottom pic doesn't inspire too much confidence... are those lines on the chassis set by the software or did you add them? Looking at them vs the mesh there is almost 2mm of difference in places..... I'd be very cautous designing mountings to that 

I think I'm right in my expectations I was looking at this as an overlay or underlay that will quickly give reference, for shape, style lines, clearance and to give others a quick reference so the drawings are more understandable... but I'd still measure and model the mounting area of the chassis and just delete out that section of the mesh 

[elbekko]

10 minutes ago, De Ranged said:

The top one is really good! The body detail is spot on, you could design to shape and style lines from that without issue. The bottom pic doesn't inspire too much confidence... are those lines on the chassis set by the software or did you add them? Looking at them vs the mesh there is almost 2mm of difference in places..... I'd be very cautous designing mountings to that 

It actually doesn't show the whole picture - the mesh lines were from a few cm further back than the face shown. This sort of shows it better (not easy to capture in a screenshot):

The idea is definitely to use it as a general reference, and build your own shapes from there, which is what I'm playing with now.

These videos explain it quite well:

 

[De Ranged]

Thanks for that, that pic shows your section/plane makes alot more sense to me also lets you avoid scan anomalies 

Watched that video interesting.... I would have done it similar, but Fusion seems to have better options than Solidworks.... I'm on an older version due to hardware limitations  and my research has shown solidworks has only really sorted mesh tools in the latest version (which I don't meet the req for lol). This was part of my desicion to go with the Revopoint scanner... there software has low requirements 

[FridgeFreezer]

@De Ranged I've watched a few YT videos on these things and there are quite a few cheap household products like hairspray / dry shampoo etc. that do the job of the "proper" spray and either wipe away easily or evaporate. It's all about making the surface matte and with a little texture to it so the scanner can pick up surface details, there's no great socket science behind it. Cheap grey or white primer in a rattle can would probably be fine for a lot of car parts especially if you can live with a bit of extra paint on them,

[elbekko]

The stuff I bought together with the scanner is this:

https://www.3dprima.com/3d-printers-more/others/3d-scanner/aesub-white-scanning-spray-400-ml_27665_9126

Cheap enough to take a punt on, but haven't used it yet.

[simonr]

On 3/9/2024 at 1:16 AM, De Ranged said:

solidworks has only really sorted mesh tools in the latest version

That's true - but it's still pretty clunky to use!  I use an add-in called Xtract3D which is better, but still not perfect.

Fusion has a much better toolset for dealing with meshes.

 

I've been using Chalk Spray: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Montana-Chalk-Temporary-Marking-Eco-Friendly/dp/B00JEECAEW/ref=sr_1_5

It has the advantage of being available in multiple colours.  The scan specific spray always seems to be white, which is great until you want to scan a shiny white thing!

[De Ranged]

Thank you guys appreciate the tips..... the downsides of living on an island on the other side of the world $160 spray can's lol 

One of the first things I want to scan is shiny(ish) white.... a mate who has died, his motorcycle helmet. I've been asked by his widow to make something special for his ashes, my plan was to scan it and print a smaller version I can use for approval and then as a buck to fit the sections of sheetmetal too.... it has a patina from all his trips and I don't want to clean any of this off by mistake when I clean off hairspray for example 
 Been thinking about what you guys have said and a few tips I've seen online.... I was thinking of trying crushed and dusted on chalkboard chalk, pink, red or orange 

 

7 hours ago, simonr said:

That's true - but it's still pretty clunky to use!  I use an add-in called Xtract3D which is better, but still not perfect.

Fusion has a much better toolset for dealing with meshes.

Given the libraries of projects I've designed I don't really want to give up on SW's lol, after talking with guys from the Ender printer groups I've downloaded Blender, its a graphics design software thats free and low resourse requirements, from what they've said it will allow me to edit the mesh to make it more useable as a background/texture or as in the helmet to tidy up the shape..... as of yet I haven't play'd with it, My scanner is a couple of weeks away ex china 

At this stage I don't see much reverse engineering use for the scanner and given the price point compared with commercail scanners and the Range2 I'm not expecting too much (my expectations have gone up a bit after seeing what elbekko has done with his after just afew days playing)
Xtract3D would be interesting, being able to convert to models..... I may look at getting a 3 month licence if I can justify it through work lol. Simonr what is Xtract3D like for surface profile work (a weakness of mine in SW I work in weldments or solids) as I potentially have a couple of projects where I'd want to model entire vehicle bodies

[elbekko]

6 hours ago, De Ranged said:

One of the first things I want to scan is shiny(ish) white.... a mate who has died, his motorcycle helmet. I've been asked by his widow to make something special for his ashes, my plan was to scan it and print a smaller version I can use for approval and then as a buck to fit the sections of sheetmetal too.... it has a patina from all his trips and I don't want to clean any of this off by mistake when I clean off hairspray for example 

Depending on the colour scheme, texture mode might work. Just pure white could be a challenge, and might require markers. A small turntable (maybe you have a welding positioner or something?) could also help for that.

On another note, I forgot to add I experimented a bit with the included WiFi bridge as well. That seems to work fine, both with a phone and a computer. It seemed to have a little bit less bandwidth maybe than just straight USB-C, but not being tethered to the cable was nice.
But what this thing really needs is a start/stop button on the handle, instead of having to reach over to the phone/computer.

I've also noticed the phone app has an undo button while scanning, but the computer one doesn't for some reason. That's too bad.

I think for now my biggest limitation is my Fusion360 skills Haven't had much more time this weekend to play around with the model. Last I tried was fitting some sheetmetal sketches to the mesh, which worked well, except that I defined my plane slightly wrong so it wasn't level. For some reason you can create a plane at an angle to a feature, but not another plane, which is weird...

[simonr]

7 hours ago, De Ranged said:

Simonr what is Xtract3D like for surface profile work

I don't know!  I tend to use it for planar surface & feature extraction - for reverse engineering.  For that, it's very useful.

Speaking to one of my friends, he says he uses Blender when he's trying to work with 'sucked sweet' (as he put it) type shapes to extract surfaces & bring them in to SW.  However, I've never used Blender so have no idea about the workflow

[simonr]

33 minutes ago, elbekko said:

But what this thing really needs is a start/stop button on the handle, instead of having to reach over to the phone/computer.

I've also noticed the phone app has an undo button while scanning, but the computer one doesn't for some reason. That's too bad.

It wouldn't be hard to design a handle + phone holder with a couple of buttons linked to levers which press on the appropriate bit of the phone screen.  You can get pen type stiluses which will trigger a touch on a phone screen - so if the lever had the rubber tip from one of these, they could simulate the touch.

I downloaded this handle for the Einstar - which makes the thing much more comfortable & stable to use:

I re-mixed it a bit, adding the boss on the right which takes a 1/4 Thread insert.  I have one of these screws which pokes through te other hole to secure it to the scanner, which, when not in use screws into the thread for storage.

EINSTAR HANDLE 2.STL

[elbekko]

That's not a bad idea. Would require me to get along with my 3D printer again though...
Although so far I've preferred using a computer with the scanner. It's more powerful, you're swinging around less weight, and getting the scan off the phone to the computer is a bit of a pain.

I think just using a bluetooth mouse app would probably work to press the button remotely. Or one of those bluetooth presenter remote thingies ziptied to the handle.