sbs_piper Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 Hi, I am new to this forum so HI, I have been reading this thread with interest as I own both a 110 and a frontera. The idiot in the original post should not be remembered as a "Fronty" driver more as an idiot... If he had been driving a LR/SJ410/Land cruiser whatever, would his actions have been any different? I doubt it. Its him that is the problem not his choice of 4X4. From reading on a lot of 4X4 Forums, the Fronty gets a lot of bad press, but how many of the people that give it such bad press have actually been out with a group of serious "green lane / Off road " fronty drivers. I am sure you would soon realise that in the majority they have exactly the same goals/aims as any other 4X4 driver. Every class of 4X4 vehicle has its share of idiots and its share of enthusiasts, and I am sure we can all get along. I have many great days with many different 4X4's. So please don't condemn Fronty's just because of one post.... next time your out look at some LR drivers, than can be just as bad... sbs_piper. Rant over. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyoldgit Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 I guess that most people here do not listen to Radio4's The Archers. (An everyday tale of country folk ) There is a story line running at the moment about abuse of the footpaths and bridleways around the village by "Off-Roaders", cars, motorbikes and quads. One farmer has started blocking the lanes (farm access lanes I think) by building mounds of earth at the ends leaving gaps for "walkers, riders and trail bikes"Chris Yes indeed (I'm not ashamed to admit that SWMBO & I listen to the Archers - there I've come out and I feel better for it ). There have also been a few negative comments about green lane use appearing in Alisdair Mitchell's column in Shooting Times just recently too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillbilly Raider Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 Hi Sbs i dont think anyone on here was "having a go" at him because he was a "Fronty" driver. And if he was driving a LR i think you would find he would get the same responce! As i said in a previous post, your adverage "Joe Rambler/ member of the public" labels most 4x4s as LRs or J**ps, they are not fussy they hate us all! IMO the original poster is doing ALL 4x4s a favour by bringing this to the attention of the "Fronty" people so they may police their own as we in the LR world do? It is up to ALL 4x4 clubs to "gang" up on indviduals to insure that the public are educated in the knowledge that WE ( clubs)do not find behaviour like this exceptable either.! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 Hi, I am new to this forum so HI, I have been reading this thread with interest as I own both a 110 and a frontera. The idiot in the original post should not be remembered as a "Fronty" driver more as an idiot... If he had been driving a LR/SJ410/Land cruiser whatever, would his actions have been any different? I doubt it. Its him that is the problem not his choice of 4X4. From reading on a lot of 4X4 Forums, the Fronty gets a lot of bad press, but how many of the people that give it such bad press have actually been out with a group of serious "green lane / Off road " fronty drivers. I am sure you would soon realise that in the majority they have exactly the same goals/aims as any other 4X4 driver. Every class of 4X4 vehicle has its share of idiots and its share of enthusiasts, and I am sure we can all get along. I have many great days with many different 4X4's. So please don't condemn Fronty's just because of one post.... next time your out look at some LR drivers, than can be just as bad... sbs_piper. Rant over. Cheers Welcome first of all. I agree fully with your comments above the vehicle is a total irrelevance the driver is. this site isn't one for we are better than you. anyoneis welcome to join. a fronterra/suzuki/mercedes/jeep are all just cars as a L/R is. please take time to read some of the other stuff on here along with the eventsa being organised and maybe try and get along to some, you'll soon see most here are just the same as evryone else, keen 4x4 owners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyoldgit Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 Yes indeed (I'm not ashamed to admit that SWMBO & I listen to the Archers - there I've come out and I feel better for it ). Quite a long piece about the Archers piece on BBC Radio 4's 'feedback' programme too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Marshall Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 I'm not ashamed to admit that SWMBO & I listen to the Archers - there I've come out and I feel better for it Might as well all come out, then - I even listen to the Omnibus edition on a Sunday so I hear the lot twice! One of the current lead stories is illegal use by off road cars and quads on David Archer's bridleway....currently they are planning a round-the-clock monitor of the route to catch the truck that almost hit a young child and also damaged David's Land Rover. Such programmes have a big following, particularly in urban areas and therefore influence the majority's views on how to manage the countryside. Strange that the storyline is running at the same time that NERC is in Comittee Stage in the House of Lords. But just for once, the editorial team were taken to task for 'bias and distasteful story lines' by a number of listeners on the R4 programme 'Feedback' today, including strong condemnation for 'confusing legal and illegal activities'. The Editor claimed that she 'had no access to the parliamentary timetable', by the way, a disgraceful excuse!! However, she also admitted that in one episode next week, the David Archer character will concede that 'Off road clubs work to a code of Practice' [GLASS and CRAG friends please note]. Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 I was glad to hear that the producers were taken to task on Feedback. Hear it here. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbocharger Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 On a slightly tangential note, it is still possible for greenlaners to get lost. I've done it, on Salisbury Plain and around Bath. I think the crucial differences are in how you drive, and your attitude when challenged. On Salisbury Plain we were stopped by modplod for being off-track (near the Bustard) and we explained how we'd made the mistake (the established track was illegal, the byway wasn't evident on the ground) and trotted off after he'd wiggled his moustache and educated us a little. Near Bath, I've not been challenged but I drove to minimise the impact on the ground as I worked out where I was and how to get back. I think we should all support the 'naming and shaming' of offenders and show that the responsible 4x4 community distances itself from such people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 24, 2006 Author Share Posted February 24, 2006 I think the subject of naming and shaming is workable. The only problem is what you 'say'. If you saw a vehicle doing something illegal, you could take a picture, use photoshop or similar to remove the number plate, then post the picture in a gallery called, for instance 'interesting greenlane pictures'. You could say I saw this vehicle on 'the ridgeway last Sunday' and make no ther comment, You would have recorded him/her doing wahtever they were doing, but are making no comment or judgement on what's occurring. Of course, the owner might then post a reply saying 'Oi, that was me', but then I doubt it somehow. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 I think the subject of naming and shaming is workable. The only problem is what you 'say'. If you saw a vehicle doing something illegal, you could take a picture, use photoshop or similar to remove the number plate, then post the picture in a gallery called, for instance 'interesting greenlane pictures'. You could say I saw this vehicle on 'the ridgeway last Sunday' and make no ther comment, You would have recorded him/her doing wahtever they were doing, but are making no comment or judgement on what's occurring. Of course, the owner might then post a reply saying 'Oi, that was me', but then I doubt it somehow. Les. If you've got a photo of them doing something illegal, I see no problem with posting it with their number plate visible. As far as I'm aware (I'm not a lawyer, though) the danger is only in making accusations for which you have no clear proof. As to posting the photo without any accusation, while that quite possibly sidesteps libel issues, it has a danger all of it's own - it would not be obvious to anyone unfamiliar with the forum that we were condemning the actions depicted. Quite possibly we would appear to be glorifying them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 25, 2006 Author Share Posted February 25, 2006 I see what you mean Geoff, the RA and other bodies could just link to the pictures 'flower them up' and save themselves a lot of work in making us look bad. What a pity theses stubborn individuals won't discuss issues with us. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NegevLandRover Posted February 25, 2006 Share Posted February 25, 2006 Les - beat them at their own game. If you set up "policing" teams to help look after what are in the end your interests too then you will have a common denominator with the "greenies" and will show them that off roaders can also be responsible "users" of green lanes. See my last post on "Make a real difference". You guys have to change your strategy before public opinion becomes ireversable. Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niall_CSK Posted February 25, 2006 Share Posted February 25, 2006 Correct me if I'm wrong Les. I assumed that the only reason you mentioned the marque was in an effort to indentify the individual, I don't hear any 5'8" thick set/fat people complaining. I think the plot has been lost a bit. As soon as we start indentifyng the fact that we need better policing rather than just blanket BANS on everything the better. I nearly died after being stabbed by a bunch of druggies with kitchen & stanley knives but I was incensed to hear about the hunting knife ban, it doesn't solve the problem. Hello, anyone in the government listening...............didn't think so. I would have posted this on the Frontera forum but I don't have time today, feel free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillbilly Raider Posted February 25, 2006 Share Posted February 25, 2006 None of you have picked up on the fact (when talking of "policing" the lanes) that if OTHER users "misbehaved" you could report them too! If you saw a Rambler or Biker misusing a lane then they could be photographed too? ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minivin Posted February 25, 2006 Share Posted February 25, 2006 Biker Oiy! get it right! they're an "off-road motorcycle enthusiast", a Biker is someone who rides all year round, rebuilds and builds his own motorcycles, gets pisht at motorcycle rallies et cetera, not a poncy multi-coloured-armour-and pointy-chin-helmet wearing sunday rider <cough> but yeah agree with what you say Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 25, 2006 Author Share Posted February 25, 2006 Niall Indeed, my mentioning the make of vehicle was to post as much information concerning him - not to have a go at Frontera drivers. I referred to Frontera websites because he had a Fronterasport web address on his motor. The devation from what is after all just a request to identify someone, is really bizarre. One of the posters says he has come across frequent prejudice concerning his vehicle type. I have to say I've never heard of people insulting them. It's normally Suzuki's, and they, if any have more right to complain about that. I'm getting close to nailing this moron now, so hopefully the paranoia will end. Fortunately a lot of help and information has come from Frontera owners themselves, who underneath all of this seem to be as concerned as the rest of us about this matter. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted February 25, 2006 Share Posted February 25, 2006 I'm getting close to nailing this moron now, You are starting to sound like DI Burnside or someone from The Sweeney now Les. "I'M LES HENSON AND I'VE NOT HAD MY TEA!!" Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S4R4_06 Posted February 25, 2006 Share Posted February 25, 2006 Well yesterday was rather tarnished by people/vehicles that are percieved by others to be the same as us.We came across a river crossing and on approach it appeared that a white Frontera was stuck in the middle of the river as it was going back and forth in the middle. There was also two other vehicles coming down the rock steps. We had to wait for them to clear, and it became evident that the white Frontera wasn't crossing the river, but reversing up it. He eventually came to a halt off to one side, in the river, close to the bank. The reason in doing so was that he could be in a good position to film his friends as they crossed. Fi pointed out to him that what he was doing was wrong and that he should follow GLASS' guidlines. His attitude was one of agression, and incredible ignorance. He eventually exited the river behind the other two vehicles, mounted the grass bank (off the track), stopped, revved his engine, dumped the clutch and sprayed us with mud, stopped again, revved his engine, dumped the clutch, sprayed us again with mud, then did the same for a third time before tearing off up the track. As we continued in the direction this guy had come form, we came across some very fresh extensive damage to the area around the byeway. The track was fairly even, but the surrounding peatland obviously looked more fun, so the side of the track was badly rutted and damaged, but by the passing of one or two vehicles at high speed. A track that had been repaired by GLASS a few months previously had this damage:- On a woodland track you might expect to see this kind of surface, but this was a surfaced track. Stones and mud were sprayed in all directions. Totally unnecessary damage in my opinion. Second picture of the same area. Damage to the peat bog at the sides can just be seen. We saw a few other examples of excessive and unnecessary damage. Unfortunately, I can in some way sympathise with walkers etc who come across this sort of thing. We met a guy From GLASS on saturday (in Sarn Helen?). Dunno if he saw this, but I don't think he's going to be very happy about it either. I can't say for definite that the vehicles we met earlier were responsible for this or not, but the damage had been gone over very recently, and their irresponsible behaviour makes it at least suspicious. Finally, if any of you come across a very big bald guy with no neck (or brain cells), in a white Frontera, that is stuck and asks for help, you might consider the above story. Les. LMFAO as mentioned white frontera drivers attitude was one of aggression didnt seem that way from my boyfriends point of view (the boy with the video camera) as he saw it the lady mentioned was rather rude and had a bad attuide herself, think this was due to our vehicles being fronteras. as for damage to the area there is no prof that it was any off them. get a grip on yourselfs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR90 Posted February 25, 2006 Share Posted February 25, 2006 No issue with Fronteras (jeeps, toyotas, gwagons, unimogs, izuzu, or whatever) here but you'll have read that. Gosh, guess I'll now have offended the Dacia drivers for not mentioning Dusters. Anyway, thanks for joining and posting. Do you share the concerns of GLASS, CRAG and many of the 4x4 community that our access to unsurfaced roads is being undermined? Seems whatever your friend was or wasn't doing if fellow 4x4 drivers thought it inappropriate then I'm sure some of the anti's would have had much stronger views had they seen it. Does that not bother you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Jenkins Posted February 25, 2006 Share Posted February 25, 2006 LMFAO as mentioned white frontera drivers attitude was one of aggression didnt seem that way from my boyfriends point of view (the boy with the video camera) as he saw it the lady mentioned was rather rude and had a bad attuide herself, think this was due to our vehicles being fronteras. as for damage to the area there is no prof that it was any off them. get a grip on yourselfs. It's always difficult to approach a complete stranger and offer criticism of their behaviour without appearing to have 'an attitude problem'. Personally I think it's quite brave to have the courage to do such a thing, and I know that what was said was meant genuinely. True, we can't assume for sure that it was your friends' work that damaged those tracks, but their behaviour made us jump to that conclusion. Like LR90 says, if fellow 4x4 drivers like us came to that conclusion what are the rambler brigade going to assume? We are all judged by even the simplest of our actions, it's human nature. BTW, I also drive a Toyota Hilux pickup so honestly no prejudice against other vehicles. regards Mark J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 25, 2006 Author Share Posted February 25, 2006 The Lady concerned is a Highways agency officer, and your boy(?)friend was being an idiot. How can you be nice while telling someone they are an idiot ? If he thinks he's so right, then how come he's making idiot remarks inside the protection of a Yahoo group. If he thinks he's right, then he should be here explaining himself and not you? Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 L!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Marshall Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 You are starting to sound like DI Burnside or someone from The Sweeney Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 26, 2006 Author Share Posted February 26, 2006 Who is D.I Burnside? Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minivin Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 LR should REALLY NOT paint their vehicles a high gloss finish when there is not a straight panel anywhere on the vehicle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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