Stainless Steel Exhaust system - 300tdi 110

[Pastycrimper]

When it doesn't rain in pours as they say which is very appropriate given the weather.

I had an advisory notice on my MOT for exhaust. Having just inspected it I actually cannot believe they didn't fail it as the tail pipe from rear box just came off in my hand and theres another three holes on the welded pipe to box sections all along so its time for more expense. I was just going to get a standard centre and tail section although this did prompt me reconsidering a de-CAT SS exhaust. Having done a bit of research it suddenly strikes me that there are quite a lot of manufacturers. I just asked a mechanic to price one up and they came back with £753.24 inc VAT and delivery but not fitted which I thought was steep!!!

I just looked at Paddocks and they appear to be selling a complete Double S system for £325 exc VAT. Additionally I have heard tale of some SS exhausts being built badly which given one is paying for a top quality bit of kit would really frustrate me if I invested and got something noyt quite up to par.........so it begs the question does anyone recommend or not recommend a particular brand and what do people expect the prices to be?

Additional - I just received a call from Longlife saying they could fit a complete assemly if I get my vehicle to them for £300 ex VAT.....anyone got a Longlife?

Thanks again in advance

[Pastycrimper]

Having trawled the main online suppliers (Paddocks, D4x4, Island4x4, Craddock, Rimmerbros etc) I get the feeling that the SS exhausts they supply are the "Double S" brand. SO far I have only found "Double S", "Longlife" and "Terrafirma" SS exhausts, so perhaps there aren't as many as I initially thought. As mentioned I have had a quote for a "Longlife" one fitted for £300 with full lifetime guarentee which is sounding like the cheapest option.

[Spearos]

IIRC with the longlife exhausts the quality depends greatly with which depot you use.

However I believe there is a thread in the Tech Achive (or somehwere) by Hybrid from Hell, about stainless exhausts on V8s... and I don't think he was too pleased with his experience of Longlife! I may be wrong though so possibly worth a look.

[CwazyWabbit]

Double SS (hmmm would that actually be SSSS ?) get quite well rated. I believe Ralph (Western) has one of their exhausts fitted and MickeyW also had one of their exhausts which he only sold on as he was changing stuff about and it no longer fitted.

[oneandtwo]

I have one on my 90, not sure who manufactured it as it was on there when I bought it. The quality is not great, the silencer box is of good quality stainless however the pipes coming to and from it are of poor quality stainless and have begun to rust. The flange clamps are mild steel and very rusty although it is better than a standard exhaust system.

[Pastycrimper]

Thanks Chaps. I'll see what Ralph has to say as he's close to me and try and find Hybrids posts on the subject.

Spearos - interesting comment. The Longlife Depot in Cornwall has literally just opened not that helps decide on their expertise but may mean that their staff are new to the "expensive machine that they use to bend the pipe" (so said the chap I spoke to)......although in my opinion it will be the quality of final welding that matters.

[Simon Smith]

I had a Double S exhaust on my old 110, I know that was years ago but it was so bloody awful I took it off and sent it back for a refund, Poor joints but mostly just completely the wrong shape and didn't fit at all well. On my current 110 I have a Janspeed stainless, which is excellent, but I'm not sure if they still do them.

[andy2986]

Hiya,

I've just bought a stainless exhaust for my 300tdi disco from Griffen Exhausts.

I haven't fitted it yet but on first inspection the build quality is very good.

Andy

[western]

Double SS (hmmm would that actually be SSSS ? ) get quite well rated. I believe Ralph (Western) has one of their exhausts fitted and MickeyW also had one of their exhausts which he only sold on as he was changing stuff about and it no longer fitted.

Correct Barry,

been on for in excess of 12 years now, only problem was a cracked flange on forward end of front silencer, replaced that section with a straight through pipe from DoubleS, bought direct from the guys at Cullompton, http://forums.lr4x4....centre silencer

[western]

Thanks Chaps. I'll see what Ralph has to say as he's close to me and try and find Hybrids posts on the subject.

Spearos - interesting comment. The Longlife Depot in Cornwall has literally just opened not that helps decide on their expertise but may mean that their staff are new to the "expensive machine that they use to bend the pipe" (so said the chap I spoke to)......although in my opinion it will be the quality of final welding that matters.

I'm at home this weekend if you want to drop in for a look.

[sammyb]

ho much louder does the Double SS system make the truck??

[western]

haven't noticed a great increase over the last 15 years with it fitted, but then it's not a fully noise insulated 110 by any means, just standard County trim.conversation at 60/65 is easy, no shouting or raised voices, CD's can be heard easily.

[reb78]

and try and find Hybrids posts on the subject.

Here you go:

http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=31256

I have one on my tdi from the same place as HFH. Really nice system and nice bunch that fitted it too. A long way from you though!!

[zardos]

IIRC with the longlife exhausts the quality depends greatly with which depot you use.

However I believe there is a thread in the Tech Achive (or somehwere) by Hybrid from Hell, about stainless exhausts on V8s... and I don't think he was too pleased with his experience of Longlife! I may be wrong though so possibly worth a look.

My experience of LongLife (Battersea) was bad, but they have been removed from the dealer network now for constant bad work.

[Pastycrimper]

Thanks once again everyone. Enjoyed reading HFH threads - very interesting but specific to the V8. It seems that the Double S ones that are sold everywhere, are already built (bend/welded) to the landrover OE design sections although of all of the reviews I have read Double S were the most variable with more negatives. Trying to assess everything I have read I get the impression that the pipes are fine but flanges and hangers are all mild steel. Additionally some threads mention that the double S pipes were significantly smaller diameter than the OE design which is bad.

A lot of people including HFH have had there best success with specialist custom exhaust firms so I have been looking up these in Cornwall. The new Longlife depot down here, as well as a company who fits Powerflow exhausts each claim that they make the exhaust up on site.....which sounds pretty custom. I can choose the pipe diameter etc so I guess this is then down to their expertise (which unless anyone has used South Crofty garage (Powerflow) or Longlife (Dub Bits - St.Austel) I have no idea about). I think I may just pop along and check them out in person.

Finally I was going to get a deCAT front pipe but leave the rest a standard but does using a straight through (removing centre box) make much difference to power. I was under the impression using a deCAT front pipe made the most difference but if adding a straight through increases power too then maybe I'll consider this. Time to get on the phone and ask detailed questions....

[Pastycrimper]

Additional - Can anyone tell me what the standard LR exhaust diameter is for a 300tdi 110?. I've read elsewhere that is is 2.375" or 3" which is a big difference. I am thinking 2.5" seems available readily. One chap I spoke to said bending 3" beyond 45degs on the front pipe can be tricky.....

[reb78]

Standard is 2 inches i think. My custom exhaust is 2.5 inches - Powerspeed at Ashford (same place as HFH used) reckoned anything more was excessive (and more expensive). There are other reasons for which 3 inches is a bad idea that were mentioned to me when i was thinking of getting mine done. Hopefully Vulcan Bomber will come along and tell you what they were cos i cant remember now!

[Pastycrimper]

Standard is 2 inches i think. My custom exhaust is 2.5 inches - Powerspeed at Ashford (same place as HFH used) reckoned anything more was excessive (and more expensive). There are other reasons for which 3 inches is a bad idea that were mentioned to me when i was thinking of getting mine done. Hopefully Vulcan Bomber will come along and tell you what they were cos i cant remember now!

Thanks Reb78. I actually just found another thread on LRO which VulcanBomber has mentioned loads of useful stuff (http://www.lro.com/forum3/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=80638). I'm currently thinking 2.5" deCAT setup. I cant reaally work out if putting a straight through centre pipe and removing centre silencer actually improves perfomance. Clearly removing the CAT will, but if a straight through is just going to be noiser then I cant see the benefit (I normally do quite a few long distance drives). But Ralph and others seem to think they get slightly better "response" with a straight through without much noise change.

[reb78]

Thanks Reb78. I actually just found another thread on LRO which VulcanBomber has mentioned loads of useful stuff (http://www.lro.com/f...hp?f=18&t=80638). I'm currently thinking 2.5" deCAT setup. I cant reaally work out if putting a straight through centre pipe and removing centre silencer actually improves perfomance. Clearly removing the CAT will, but if a straight through is just going to be noiser then I cant see the benefit (I normally do quite a few long distance drives). But Ralph and others seem to think they get slightly better "response" with a straight through without much noise change.

Removing the centre pipe helped with performance on my standard exhaust, however, the noise was too much for me. I regularly do 400+ miles in mine and didnt enjoy that constant groan. It was at this point that i decided on the stainless exhaust. I have two silencers in mine, but these are partly offset by the wider than normal diameter and the fact the the silencers are designed to flow better than standard items. One thing that came out as i researched the stainless exhausts was that they are naturally a little louder than mild steel as they dont tend to get as much of that sooty coating on the inside (which acts to deaden the sound) as they are smoother and allow more air flow.

[Pastycrimper]

I guess noise is a very personal thing. I like the sound of the turbo but am not interested in roaring groans and grumbles. As far as I'm concerned, removing the CAT does much more than removing the middle box regarding performance. I also do 400+ mile journeys.....did Cornwall to Moss, Norway earlier in the year which is 1300miles. Yet some people say that removing the centre box doesn't make it much noiser which I guess is down to individual ears. I'm going to do west Ireland with Mrs as well as portugal hopefully in 2013 - she will be the true test of noise levels!

I'll enquire about the internals of the silencer boxes that the company intend on fitting.

[Pastycrimper]

Grrrr....the more I look into this the more issues and questions seem arise. Now it is between sleave joints vs flanges to connect sections (aside from the flange at the turbo outlet). Clearly many SSsystems (based on my research) still use mild steel flanges (which slightly defies the point of SS system to me). The current people I have been enquiring with say that all of their sections are connected with SS sleaves and clamps and aside from connecting to the turbo outlet, do not use flanges. Yet I have just spoken to someone else I know who works on Landys who said that flanges are much better due to problems that occur with expansion and contraction with sleaved joints...???

Anyone care to cast their opinion on whats better? At this rate I'm just going revert back to standard mild steel aftermarket exhaust. I figured I'd be prepared to spend up to £400 on a SS number but starting to feel that unless this is done properly by someone like HFH used then its just a waste of money......crikey this is only a damn exhaust, not exactly the most technical part of a landrover!

[western]

the 3 bolt flage joints on my system have only given one fail [cracked flange] otherwise all have been fine, none have corroded to dust.

[Simon Smith]

And the one sleeve on mine have been fine too, despite not having a clamp on it for about 5 years, as has the flange joint at the downpipe. I don't think theres much to choose between the two methods of joining apart from sleeved joints sometimes being a pain to get apart. From what I've seen of the current Double S pipes, they have improved 100% since I had one, so I would go wiith whoever gives the best deal.

[Pastycrimper]

So I visited the local garage and had a look at there kit and also a defender on the ramp but that only had the rear done in stainless but it looked very well done. All SS, and they used the original hanging points.

However they did say that they cant bend 2.5" pipe beyond 50degrees which means that they can only do a complete system using 2.25" pipework which I believe is very slightly smaller than original (I beleieve 300tdi exhaust to be 2.375" but I may be wrong. Anyone think 2.25" will be a bad move?