Devon 4x4 Competition Suspension Package - Fully Loaded vs. gwyn lewis

[benbenukuk]

Which one will be better the Devon kit http://www.devon4x4.com/products_b/k2c160/...lly-loaded.html or the Gwyn Lewis http://www.gwynlewis4x4.co.uk/page56a.html cheers. Ben

[ex_mod_90]

Which one will be better the Devon kit http://www.devon4x4.com/products_b/k2c160/...lly-loaded.html or the Gwyn Lewis http://www.gwynlewis4x4.co.uk/page56a.html cheers. Ben

Hi Ben.

'Better' is all a matter of opinion. If you want articulation, then Gwyn Lewis kit wins hands down. A mate of mine bought the devon kit, and the articulation is pretty awful. So much so in fact that he has changed it over to gwyns front and rear mounts with rough country shocks.

Firstly the shocks that Devon use are'nt as long as Gwyns, yes both kits use OME, but Gwyn's are much longer (Cant remember the figures now, but I think 11.5") Devon's are no where near that.

Secondly, Gwyn's kit uses pin-pin fixings, at the rear. Devon use the ring and pin arrangement as standard, but use a very expensive mount which IMHO is pretty pointless, as it doesn't seem to add anything.

Both kits ride well on the road, however offroad the difference is like night and day. Hope this helps.

Rich.

[JST]

if you have axle lockers you dont need all the articulation and tonnes of articulation with minimal weight on it doesn't do much anyway, unless your into twist off ramps i suppose.

[treebloke]

Looks like you get good quality front and rear prop with GL's.

[andylandy]

i used d44 to do rainforest challenge and wouldnt look any further if your carrying a lot of wieght

but if you wont a rti go buy gwyn`s

[simonr]

Personally, I wouldn't buy anybodies 'complete package' (Even mine!).

Thing is, everybody has different requirements and drives differently. There is no reason that any one package is going to be good for everybody!

I would use a mixture of kit from different suppliers depending on what suits your needs best.

Also, only change one thing at a time. That way you can see the effect (good or bad) of each modification - and potentially save a heap of cash on Lemons.

I guess i'm agreeing with Andy (sort of). Had to happen eventually!

Si

[MrHT]

if you have axle lockers you don't need all the articulation and tonnes of articulation with minimal weight on it doesn't do much anyway, unless your into twist off ramps i suppose.

I agree with that but I've put Gwyn's on the back of mine so that the vehicle becomes more stable when at acute angles because the centre of gravity is lower with the wheels further away.

Just make sure you get the springs you need for the job your doing. Nothing worse than certain springs that lift your vehicle but when it comes down to articulating don't compress and allow the wheel to come up.

[jungletrekker]

Hello all,

I had devons kit and it worked a treat, but I found with a county spec and a fair bit of weight up top (and being a wuss!! ) that the truck was not very stable. I bit the bullit and got the complete Glyn kit and what a transformation. Yes lockers get you further and when the rear wheel is on full droop it may not be offering any grip, but it sure as hell makes you feel a tad more confident when your not rocking!! Hope this helps, only my pennies worth!

Ben

[pongo]

Gwyns is well proven, used by loads of comp motors. I have it on my (non-comp) 90, and it is very stable on road, and lovely off. Almost everything is galvanised too, so it will last for years with no horrible corrosion.

Can't comment on D44s though, not used it.

[gsr341]

i run gwyns kit and really like it ,

not done many comps in my truck and 1000s of road miles with no problems at all , its a very very well ballanced kit at a very good price , best thing to do if its possable is get a ride (or just a look) at a truck with each kit fitted or phone gwyn or simon and have a chat .

if your not desprate for the kit why not try and get along to the indoor 4x4 show in donnington in feb devon have a stand there and im sure gwyn will pop along and maybe bring a kit down for you to see if you give him a ring in adavance .

not decided if im going yet but if i do will bring my truck down and you can take a look at it

regards

Dafydd

[FLASH]

I have just fitted gwyns kit to my 90 I did not bother to look at anybody else's as it can get very confusing their is that much stuff out there and when you talk to gwyn he has utmost confidence in the products he sells. He even let me try his disco which is fully kitted with his own package

[robhybrid]

Extra articulation isnt as critical if you have lockers?

I belive the longer you can drive without lockers the less strain you end up putting on your drive line, as the load is spread accross all drive shafts for as long as possible.

I am biased as I occasionally work for Gwyn.

Another point worth mentioning is that the shocks used by Gwyn are the same all round so If you do want to carry a spare you only need to carry one.

Both Gwyn and Simon(devon) use/recomend ome springs and shocks.

There are a lot of people on this forum who use Gwyn's kit but with different shocks and springs.

Different shocks do allow you to make some savings but if you ever get to try two vehicles back to back where the only difference is shocks it is a very educational experiance.

[JST]

Extra articulation isnt as critical if you have lockers?

I belive the longer you can drive without lockers the less strain you end up putting on your drive line, as the load is spread accross all drive shafts for as long as possible.

food for thought

if you drive with no locks in (all 3 open) then 100% torque can be transmitted through one wheel.

If you have all lockers in (middle and both axles) then only a max 25% torque can go through one wheel, therefore the spread of torque is equal.

Now if you try to put that torque through all the wheels and one wheel cant move (wedged under a over hanging bank for example) that i believe is when you will break things as your trying to turn something that cant turn, with an open locker on this axle it would allow the 50% power to escape through the other wheel

[sean f]

food for thought

if you drive with no locks in (all 3 open) then 100% torque can be transmitted through one wheel.

If you have all lockers in (middle and both axles) then only a max 25% torque can go through one wheel, therefore the spread of torque is equal.

Now if you try to put that torque through all the wheels and one wheel cant move (wedged under a over hanging bank for example) that i believe is when you will break things as your trying to turn something that cant turn, with an open locker on this axle it would allow the 50% power to escape through the other wheel

You need to go and have a think about this!.

An open diff will BALANCE the torque so the same torque is applied to each wheel (remember torque not power), with a full open diff system if one wheel lifts it will not have any torque so no torque will be applied to the other wheels either, hence that one wheel will spin but get you no where. A lot of breakages are likely to be when that one wheel suddenly does get traction and there is a high shock loading on the transmition due to the inertia of the spinning wheel suddenly slowing down.

With diffs locked the same RPM is applied to each wheel regardless of the torque so when one wheel spins in the air the other continues to rotate at the same speed. This can mean 100% of the POWER is going through that one wheel with traction which can cause overloading and breakage.

[MrHT]

food for thought

if you drive with no locks in (all 3 open) then 100% torque can be transmitted through one wheel.

If you have all lockers in (middle and both axles) then only a max 25% torque can go through one wheel, therefore the spread of torque is equal.

Now if you try to put that torque through all the wheels and one wheel cant move (wedged under a over hanging bank for example) that i believe is when you will break things as your trying to turn something that cant turn, with an open locker on this axle it would allow the 50% power to escape through the other wheel

You need to go and have a think about this!.

An open diff will BALANCE the torque so the same torque is applied to each wheel (remember torque not power), with a full open diff system if one wheel lifts it will not have any torque so no torque will be applied to the other wheels either, hence that one wheel will spin but get you no where. A lot of breakages are likely to be when that one wheel suddenly does get traction and there is a high shock loading on the transmission due to the inertia of the spinning wheel suddenly slowing down.

With diffs locked the same RPM is applied to each wheel regardless of the torque so when one wheel spins in the air the other continues to rotate at the same speed. This can mean 100% of the POWER is going through that one wheel with traction which can cause overloading and breakage.

Think you'll find your both right.

But here is a thought my friend runs full Gwyn lewis ome and 37/11.50 boggers on standard landrover axles done 2 comps and only one blown diff (and that was knackered when we put it in) he gets places people with lockers can't get. My personal belief is that Gwyn's kit has reduced the tendency to lift wheels and let them spin therefor reducing the shock load of landing on a fast spinning wheel. As proved by another friend of mine the moment he fits lockers to the axles he'll start snapping half shafts like twigs.

[pongo]

food for thought

if you drive with no locks in (all 3 open) then 100% torque can be transmitted through one wheel.

If you have all lockers in (middle and both axles) then only a max 25% torque can go through one wheel, therefore the spread of torque is equal.

Now if you try to put that torque through all the wheels and one wheel cant move (wedged under a over hanging bank for example) that i believe is when you will break things as your trying to turn something that cant turn, with an open locker on this axle it would allow the 50% power to escape through the other wheel

If a wheel is off the ground, then with no resistance applied at the wheel the torque will be negligible on that shaft. But with the axle diff locked, the wheel which has traction will get more than 25%. In the worst case, if three wheels are either flailing in the air or on slimy mud or ice, then if one wheel has traction then it will take the bulk of the torque; it has to be going somewhere. This is one area where longer travel suspension can help spread the load, thus saving shafts.

Lockers can also be used to protect shafts by preventing an airborne or tractionless wheel from spinning up and then shock-loading the shafts when it suddenly gets a bit of traction and stops spinning. This is particularly noticeable when using a bit of momentum to climb a steep and rutted hill which causes the vehicle to roll from side to side, alternately lifting opposite wheels then slamming them into the ground. Ask how many people blew diffs and shafts climbing the Americas at Eastnor Castle last year; I saw four go. I locked my diffs and ambled up with no problems.

In short, like anything, use of lockers has to be based on understanding how the transmission and suspension work together, and then applied intelligently.

[T1G UP]

As simon says!

i've used a mixture of kits.

Gwyn lewis rear shock mount with rough country shocks RRC red and white springs,home brew x springs on the rear

Tornado motorsport +2" twin shock towers, rough country, llama 4x4, shocks RRC red and white springs, home brew x springs and drilled bushes on the front...

Cheap as chips?! and very flexy because i trial on my car and will be, hopefully, doing a challenge series with no diff lockers so i need the wheels on the ground at all times

It all depends on what you iuse the car for the rest of the time.

[spcollins]

Another vote for Gwyn Lewis kit.

My 1st outing with the kit installed was last weekend and the vehicle has been transformed. The articulation is fantastic. Feels so comfortable and solid off road. And on road is far better than I expected. I went with the cheaper Rough Country dampers and thought I would be dissapointed. I have used OME dampers in the past and they are really good but thought that the spend was a little rich at the time so went with RC. I am pleasantly surprised.

When I spoke to Gwyn to discuss prop shaft options, he was very helpful and not at all in a rush to get me off the phone. I bought his kit through David in LLama 4x4. and again, David is a really nice guy... likes to talk!

On the other hand, been on to Devon 4x4 to try to buy from them (not their suspension kit - HD bumpers) and they never once called me back.... after me calling them 3 times! Went elsewhere.

[Timmy511]

reguardless of lockers or not, as x-eng say, wheels on the ground = traction.

if youve got lockers your better having both wheels on the floor getting traction rather than just one!

ive got gwyn lewis mounts and pro comp shocks (from gwyn) on my 90 and it is abasolutely awesome, todate i havnt broken any diffs or half shafts (using simex). I think gwyns kit is the best for the money and what makes it better is you dont have to buy it all at once you can just buy the back or the front, then add props etc.. as your buget allows.

[superfinder]

Hi

which springs are normally delivered with a challange suspension kit from gwyn lewis for a defender 90?

thanks for the answers

Kind regards

superfinder

[jcwcooper]

Best thing to do is give gwyn a call. There maybe a choice of springs depending what you want.

Dave.

[andy2986]

Hi,

Just replaced my rough country rear shocks on my Disco with OME from gwyn lewis. (the rough country shocks were far to soft for me) I found him very helpful and honest about various suspension products fitted to my Disco and would be more than happy to put my business through him now.

Just my two peneth worth......

Andy