forestrynick Posted August 1, 2010 Share Posted August 1, 2010 Hi all I've been trying to justify the cost of buying an air freespool kit for the goodwinch tds on my challenge truck. But so much else I could do with the money. So I had a thought the other day that it must be possible to do with string and pulleys (was in the pub at the time!). Next morning I looked at it and decided it was unpractical. However... I've used the old bonnet release cord, which handily is the right length. Mounted on a simple bracket via tie rod bolt. I can now pull the winch out of freespool from inside the cab. So poor old winch bitch can run up hill in free, attach anchor, i pull the cord and off we go! Saves battery power and winch bitch power! Maybe not so good as air freespool but should be quite reliable and its cost me precisely nothing! What do you think? Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiWhite Posted August 1, 2010 Share Posted August 1, 2010 Cracking idea. Could you mount it with a spring on the other side so that you pull the lever against the spring pressure for freespool, then release and it drives? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Sparkes Posted August 1, 2010 Share Posted August 1, 2010 Cracking idea. Could you mount it with a spring on the other side so that you pull the lever against the spring pressure for freespool, then release and it drives? Not such a good idea, because you are relying on the spring to fully engage the drive. If the mechanism jams halfway to fully engaged you would never know, until it became disengaged under load. Only IMHO, because I don't winch :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted August 2, 2010 Share Posted August 2, 2010 This is what I use to freespool my pto winch for years. I use a proper push pull cable to do this job, because the forces involved can get pretty large if the mechanism get clogged with mud, but the principle works very well. Very usefull mod, worked in Ladoga very well to save the codriver running backwards and forwards for miles on end. Daan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
errol209 Posted August 2, 2010 Share Posted August 2, 2010 I don't winch either, but two observations (I have too much time on my hands): Even with an air-operated freespool (the ones I've seen anyway) you have no failsafe indication of "engaged" (oo-er) either? Secondly, it wouldn't be a complex job to Araldite (other brands of epoxy are available) a small magnet onto the lever and detect the engaged position with a reed switch (all sealed and only one moving part anyway) or hall effect sensor (ditto but one less moving part), wired to an LED on the dashboard? Jus' thinkin' aloud ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange Posted August 3, 2010 Share Posted August 3, 2010 Or, perhaps a second cable routed down the N/S chassis leg to pull it back into the engaged position... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishbosh Posted August 4, 2010 Share Posted August 4, 2010 Trust you to get all electrikery complicated Errol!! If you use a fighter pilot switch to operate your freespool you have 1: a bloody obvious indication that the freespool is engaged and 2: a nice bling cover(multiple colours available, I used red as it matched my truck ) that stops you accidentally engaging it when pressing other buttons in a blind panic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
errol209 Posted August 4, 2010 Share Posted August 4, 2010 Trust you to get all electrikery complicated Errol!! yorself Mr Bish wiv nobs on. I suppose I was exploring the difference between commanding (requesting) a freespool operation and it actually happening. Just because you attached your "more-pressure-than-the-molten-core-of-Jupiter" air system to the freespool ram, it doesn't 100% follow that anything actually happens at the winch end. You challenge types are getting darn close to operating goods lifts! I will also declare I work in the UK railway industry, where these kind of things are somewhat over-regulated and over-designed (we have little lights that come on to tell us that other bigger lights should be on, but aren't and alarms for things that aren't described), so I might be a bit risk averse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forestrynick Posted August 4, 2010 Author Share Posted August 4, 2010 I reckon i'll know if the winch is engaged or not, if i winch in an nothing happens, stands to reason its in freespool. Similarly if i back of a cliff and find myself falling rapidly to the bottom... its in freespool! And I don't think any spring, me yanking a cable or even a fancy ass air ram could pull a winch out of 'engaged' when under load. I will investigate using a spring to put winch into freespool. Generally speaking the winch bitch is stood near the winch when this is need, so not as useful. Daan what is a push pull cable? how's it different from my bonnet release? Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted August 4, 2010 Share Posted August 4, 2010 Daan what is a push pull cable? how's it different from my bonnet release? Apologies, I'm not Daan. A push-pull or 'Morse' cable works both ways, it will transfer motion in two directions. Commonly used on throttle/gear linkages on boats, plant, remote hydraulics etc. The wire is quite a tolerenced fit in the sheath to minimise backlash, and the ends are solid (well, hollow) rod, to allow them to push and pull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forestrynick Posted August 4, 2010 Author Share Posted August 4, 2010 Apologies, I'm not Daan. A push-pull or 'Morse' cable works both ways, it will transfer motion in two directions. Commonly used on throttle/gear linkages on boats, plant, remote hydraulics etc. The wire is quite a tolerenced fit in the sheath to minimise backlash, and the ends are solid (well, hollow) rod, to allow them to push and pull. That sounds interesting, though sounds like i'd have to buy one! We have a selection of springs on the shelf so i'll try that first. Nick ps apologee accepted! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbocharger Posted August 5, 2010 Share Posted August 5, 2010 I think the danger is if the drive is only engaged on the edge of the teeth - though I'd say you could check that the cable's fully home at your end, and flick the winch drive back/forwards until it dropped in, to solve the problem? You're getting more tactile feedback with a physical cable than with air rams or similar, you might 'feel' if it didn't engage properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokey_joe Posted August 5, 2010 Share Posted August 5, 2010 I tried the same system on a challenge motor on a Husky winch. A cable to pull out of engagement and a spring to hold it engaged. Sadly despite fitting a very stiff spring and rigging up a lever arrangement in the cab to overcome the resistance of the disengagement cable, the spring did not fully engage the winch every time subsequently damaging the winch and loosing drive. I would agree that a push/ pull cable would give you a better feel and more control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gren_T Posted August 6, 2010 Share Posted August 6, 2010 Hi Chaps A good example of a morse cable is an automatic gearbox shifter cable. just a thought.... regards Gren Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted August 6, 2010 Share Posted August 6, 2010 I think in the case of the TDS/EP9 winches of this world the freespool is engaged (or disengaged if you look from a mech POV) by lifting the freespool lever, the rotational movement is not required, in which case it could be simplified by making a bracket above the lever which fixes to the cap head bolt in the middle of the freespool lever allowing you to engage just by pulling on a cable. The lever would still be able to be operated by hand from outside the vehicle, with some careful bracket fab, and the spring in the freespool lever would return it to 'locked' position once you release the cable. Now, I could be wrong in all of this, in which case shoot me I don't think so, because that's how the air freespools work that Bowyer sells (I think!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted August 6, 2010 Share Posted August 6, 2010 I have a detent ball and spring so that you know when it is properly in or out. Daan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted September 3, 2010 Share Posted September 3, 2010 Now, I could be wrong in all of this, in which case shoot me I don't think so, because that's how the air freespools work that Bowyer sells (I think!) No shooting necessary - you are spot on. The difficulty with pulling directly is the amount of force required. The return spring is v.strong and the pin only moves 8mm or so. My first attempt at this was what looked like a clothes-peg (squeeze one end and the other ends separate, lifting the pin) which multiplied the force. I then used a locking - like a choke cable with a T handle similar to a bonnet release. It worked OK but still required too much force through the cable with a 5:1 force multiplication. Next bet (which I like, but David B did not) was solenoid operated. It had a Neodimium magnet attached to the pin which would stick to a steel plate at either end of it's travel - locking it engaged or disengaged. Then use a coil (solenoid) to switch the pin between the locked and unlocked positions by applying a current in one polarity or the oither. David's concern was that it did not 'fail safe' (with the drive engaged). Instead, it fails in whatever state you left it in last - much like the original lever! The combination of the high force required and the fail engaged lead to the pneumatic solution. It works very well - but I still prefer the solenoid option! Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Nick Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 Here's Mine ! works via vacum to opperate clutch freespool so its fail safe. i.e, when no air is applied to unit, ring gear pin is locked. When applying air via switched 12 volt air valve solenoid, the unit vacums and releases the clutch pin from the ring gear, thus freespool is acheived. This unit replaces all of the original manual freespool mechanism and screws directly into the winch gearbox housing giving it a waterproof opperation. The picture shows my Tdsc winch in the rear of my 90. Ive Rotated my gear box for personal preference. This is my modified ARB Compressor with additional 12 volt solenoid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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