mike4444244 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I think mike was probably referring to the 2mm thick chassis We have all seen massively strong bumpers etc bolted with hundreds of 12.9 bolts into a rusted wafer thin dumb irons Obviously a general observation not accusing anyone... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Mike. Yes but I meant the rusted 1.5 mm steel LOL My front recovery eyes sre bolted at each chassis reail ny 10mm 12.5 bolts and 2 half inch S grade bolts to give a good spread along the chassis At the rear by screws into the cross member and again along the chassis rails as well as the two screws that would hold the twoing eye.... There again I don't use 8,000 kg cordage with 2,000 kg shackles. Should I need to recover somebody then I make sure that my straps are rater and rated below the rated shackles with sacrificial rope at each of the two shackles. Incidently. You should really recover from the axles otherwise you take the risk of pulling the chassis away from the axles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Mike. Yes but I meant the rusted 1.5 mm steel LOLMy front recovery eyes sre bolted at each chassis reail ny 10mm 12.5 bolts and 2 half inch S grade bolts to give a good spread along the chassis At the rear by screws into the cross member and again along the chassis rails as well as the two screws that would hold the twoing eye.... There again I don't use 8,000 kg cordage with 2,000 kg shackles. Should I need to recover somebody then I make sure that my straps are rater and rated below the rated shackles with sacrificial rope at each of the two shackles. Incidently. You should really recover from the axles otherwise you take the risk of pulling the chassis away from the axles. Not sure about the last statement, you might find your 90 soon becomes a 110................. The most important factors in a recovery are common sense and experience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Not sure about the last statement, you might find your 90 soon becomes a 110................. The most important factors in a recovery are common sense and experience Somebody PLEASE..The vid or pics of the blue 90 stuck in mud with the chassis pulled from the axles.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Somebody PLEASE..The vid or pics of the blue 90 stuck in mud with the chassis pulled from the axles.... I would suggest the vehicle in question had other issues, how many recovery points do you see on axle's? I for one have never. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I would suggest the vehicle in question had other issues, how many recovery points do you see on axle's? I for one have never. Why do you need a recovery point on an axle ? Wrap the cordage round the axle... Yes Defender axles do have recovery points fitted. Look at the red Ibex featured many years ago with the axle fitted for recovery .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Why do you need a recovery point on an axle ? Wrap the cordage round the axle... Yes Defender axles do have recovery points fitted. Look at the red Ibex featured many years ago with the axle fitted for recovery .... 'Cordage round the axle.......' Is that under or over the brake lines? What about spinning wheels and ropes in a close proximity? I'm sorry but you'd never catch me using this 'technique'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19MART82 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 ok lets be realistic a landrover could be recovered useing the axle,but in reality you'll probably have to dig under the axle to get the strap round (9 times out of 10 there grounded on the axle when stuck) and should the strap slip while recovering it would probably wipe out your brakeline and breather pipe,and as mentioned is dangerouse if caught by spinning wheels,personally i would rather make sure ive got sufficient recovery points before i get in that predicimant as this is the only time ive seen this method used Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The axles are linked to the chassis via radius arms, 'A' frames and panard rods etc, 99% of the time utilising metalastic bushes. I would be very surprised if these bushes were either designed or strong enough for recovery. As I said earlier your 90 would soon be a 110! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 'Cordage round the axle.......' Is that under or over the brake lines? What about spinning wheels and ropes in a close proximity? I'm sorry but you'd never catch me using this 'technique'. You must look at different axles to me. Of course your answer tells me a lot about you.,I'll spell it out for you. DIG. Yes get the spade out and clear the way underneth. Keys of car out of the ignition so you keep away from those spinning wheels. Then using the Hi-Lidt and the wheel attatchment lift each wheel in turn and chock the axle up. Then wrap the bridle around one side of the axle MISSING the brake pipe. Pass the bridle through the loop on the strap. Then wrap the other end of the bridle around the axle, Missing the brake pipes. Join with a shackle. Attatch the sacrificial rope to the bridle and to a part on the chassis or good point. Attatch the strap to the vehicle that's doing the recovering with a shackle. Attatch the sacrificial rope round the strap and to a sensable point on the recovery vehicle. Move everybody at least THREE strap lengths away from the vehicles except the two drivers. Should you have to join two straps DO NOT IN ANY CIRCUMSTANCES USE A SHACKLE. Thread each loop through the other. Now you already know how to stop two strap loops seizing during the pull ? I DON'T HAVE A 90 !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Not sure about 'different axles to me' , I run a 4x4 specialist garage ( island4x4.net ) and I'm also a BORDA trained instructor........I think we're on different planets! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19MART82 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 You must look at different axles to me. Of course your answer tells me a lot about you.,I'll spell it out for you. DIG. Yes get the spade out and clear the way underneth. Keys of car out of the ignition so you keep away from those spinning wheels. Then using the Hi-Lidt and the wheel attatchment lift each wheel in turn and chock the axle up. Then wrap the bridle around one side of the axle MISSING the brake pipe. Pass the bridle through the loop on the strap. Then wrap the other end of the bridle around the axle, Missing the brake pipes. Join with a shackle. Attatch the sacrificial rope to the bridle and to a part on the chassis or good point. Attatch the strap to the vehicle that's doing the recovering with a shackle. Attatch the sacrificial rope round the strap and to a sensable point on the recovery vehicle. Move everybody at least THREE strap lengths away from the vehicles except the two drivers. Should you have to join two straps DO NOT IN ANY CIRCUMSTANCES USE A SHACKLE. Thread each loop through the other. Now you already know how to stop two strap loops seizing during the pull ? I DON'T HAVE A 90 !!!! or you could just hook the rope to your towpoint and chuck the other end to your mate to hook to his towpoint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Now that's an idea that might catch on............... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuck Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 This forum doesn't half make me laugh at times... Peace be with you brethren. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Indeed stuck I think you lot would have messed yourselves when we snatched a 8 ton john deere sat on its belly out of a bog using two other tractors with and old bit of chain, some random bit of hawse and a frayed 2ton lifting strap at work As has been said recovery is all about being sensable, if it looks wrong and you dont want your head chopping off then walk away and have a brew, otherwise use your head and get it done. Will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jai_landrover Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Much is written in text books which any 5 year old can quote. Not everybody has real life experience. Much like braking going down steep decents. Some people scream about how you should never do it. If you have ever trialed anything more than RTV then you know that you have to, to complete the courses set out and its all to do with feel and for the first few times it goes against everything your brain and body is telling you after a while its natural. Text books say Now way and thats just bull!! I had the above er discussion/debate with a guy that came trialing with me. His 90 was a challenge thingy very blinged up but he had No experience at all. in fact he retired.because he was doing so bad. he got ribbed because he took it so bad. If he would have carried on and stuck out the comp he might have got at least some credit but he bailed never to be seen again. I have seen this axle extraction used before it works but in fact the military used to use it. I wouldn't unless you run out of other options.. I Do like the saying: You can Bull**** alot in life, Nobody can bull**** experience.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Yes that's what the OP asked TOWING......Any bit of string strong enough with two experiencied drivers will suffice.... Nah I can't and don't trial.I don't think 3.050 TONNE of Defender would cut the mustard..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jai_landrover Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 A Perfect example of misues of a strop. A decent 24 mm rope would have had that mopor out alot quicker, safer and without any jarr'd backs or tow points! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Surely the best thing there would be to pull it out the other way, or winch it?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I would have winched that red 90 out from the rear, lot less hassle & effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robhybrid Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Looks like he was working for a landrover drive train resach and development team? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbs Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I would have winched that red 90 out from the rear, lot less hassle & effort. I got recovered exactly the way you described at brox head by Nige a fair few years ago by this way-we'd tried for 25 minutes self recovery snatching with a KERR rope keeping everyone out of the way but to no avail, Nige came along and within a nano second I was winched back out and on my way very safely and no nonsense too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 No wonder people keep breaking stuff if they try and move ~5tons of LR with all wheels spinning. Winch, or even a gentle tug form behind would have taken half the time, a quarter the diesel, and left your driveline intact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agent nomad Posted January 10, 2012 Author Share Posted January 10, 2012 Thanks for the info so far as I said early on I have an idea and so have got loads of info with out public with the idea just yet but sould have one made for someone to test soon [2 to 3 weeks time] so I could be looking for a volunteer The tow rope sling is a slight distraction from the idea but the question has answered the questions I had but it could all come to nothing depending on costs. Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Yes use a winch how do you tow with a winch ?. The question was TOW ROPE. Nothing to do with recovery. How would you all have recovered the blue Defender. No winch. Short straps, nearest town three days away ??? Pulling up hill on scree and at 90 deg to the blue Defender ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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