oneandtwo Posted October 25, 2018 Share Posted October 25, 2018 We have an all singing all dancing Hartridge testmaster2 computerised injector taste at work sat redundant that I was going to put to work testing the 30 plus 300tdi injectors I have spare. I was going to programme it for 300tdi injectors but can’t find the crack off pressures and leak back specs online - anyone any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cackshifter Posted October 25, 2018 Share Posted October 25, 2018 I hope this helps if you don't already know - From the 1996 manual Make & type - standard .................................................... Bosch KBAL 90 P37 Nozzle type ...................................................................... DSLA 145P366 Opening pressure (working pressure) .............................. Initial pressure 200 atmospheres, Secondary 280 atmospheres from defendersource...Also could you please verify that the pop-off for the 2.8 injector (0 432 193 532) is 201 bar while the 300 TDI (0 432 193 835) is 200 bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneandtwo Posted October 26, 2018 Author Share Posted October 26, 2018 Thanks. It seems that although the tester is all singing, all dancing, it still requires a hideously expensive add on module for testing the second stage opening pressure.., still, at least I can measure the first stage, leakback and pattern then match up a set of them. cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 On 10/26/2018 at 7:00 PM, oneandtwo said: Thanks. It seems that although the tester is all singing, all dancing, it still requires a hideously expensive add on module for testing the second stage opening pressure.., still, at least I can measure the first stage, leakback and pattern then match up a set of them. cheers! Trying to do my own. How did you go on with a standard pop tester? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneandtwo Posted November 26, 2020 Author Share Posted November 26, 2020 4 hours ago, tweetyduck said: Trying to do my own. How did you go on with a standard pop tester? Mine isn’t really a standard pop tester - http://www.hartridge.com/products/testmaster-3-hh701/ I was actually thinking of testing another box load of 300tdi injectors shortly, I did eight or so last year, a couple failed with really poor spray pattern, I stripped the injectors down and ultrasonically cleaned the parts and reassembled them, they then passed with good spray pattern and leak back figures, but without spending £1000 on the two stage add on I can only test them to the first opening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneandtwo Posted November 26, 2020 Author Share Posted November 26, 2020 In response to your other post, from memory there is no shim stack for adjustment however all the ones I tested had initial crack off pressures almost on spec. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 super thanks. I've got new nozzles which are DTP replacement and meant to be very good ones so i will just test the opening as all i can do. I wonder what difference the second stage makes and if being way out is really bad.....in case it was... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneandtwo Posted November 27, 2020 Author Share Posted November 27, 2020 (edited) I have just removed and tested sixteen 300tdi injectors out of engines I removed from scrap discos some time ago. Out of these sixteen, only three were anything like reusable with good spray patterns and first stage crack off at between 194 and 197bar, and a long leakback duration. All the rest had poor spray patterns or were not cracking off correctly. I will strip a few and ultrasonically clean them and see if any can be resurrected at some point - new nozzles would sort out the majority. I would think that a correct spray pattern and first stage pressure would be a good indication that the injector was reasonably good without having them tested on a two stage tester They do have a two shim washers however they don’t appear to be adjustable with different shims - all the ones I stripped have identical washers. Edited November 27, 2020 by oneandtwo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted November 27, 2020 Share Posted November 27, 2020 1 hour ago, oneandtwo said: I have just removed and tested sixteen 300tdi injectors out of engines I removed from scrap discos some time ago. Out of these sixteen, only three were anything like reusable with good spray patterns and first stage crack off at between 194 and 197bar, and a long leakback duration. All the rest had poor spray patterns or were not cracking off correctly. I will strip a few and ultrasonically clean them and see if any can be resurrected at some point - new nozzles would sort out the majority. I would think that a correct spray pattern and first stage pressure would be a good indication that the injector was reasonably good without having them tested on a two stage tester They do have a two shim washers however they don’t appear to be adjustable with different shims - all the ones I stripped have identical washers. Thanks for that. That's is exactly what i needed to know. This type of info is marvellous indeed ! Based on info to come will determine what i need to do for sure. Testing the leak back is just a case of popping it and letting it sit. Is that correct. Let it sit and nothing drops? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneandtwo Posted November 27, 2020 Author Share Posted November 27, 2020 That machine is set up for testing injectors from big Mirrlees Blackstone engines, those injectors have a crack off pressure and leak back duration provided by the manufacturer which is inputted into the tester. Once the machine registers the injector cracking off it then times how long it takes for the injector to drop to a certain pressure below the crack off and issues a pass / fail. I didn’t find leak back specs for 300tdi, so yes, let the injector sit and as long as the pressure slowly drops away over 15 -20 seconds it should be a healthy injector. Some of those I tested earlier today were dropping straight away to nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted December 25, 2020 Share Posted December 25, 2020 All injectors on the truck tested. All good. Slightly low pressure on all equally which is strange....old 4 from my box got new tips and 3 were resurrected from dribbling squirting rubbish to popping atomising magnificent status. Even correct pressure or there abouts. The last one was not working. Out of them all they are all shimmed and some had 2 shims in and some one shim all various thicknesses usually about 1mm. Some 1.5mm. I cannot figure out which shim size they are from the info online so cannot buy replacements. Any body have an idea? IIRC They are 2.8mm hole and 7 point something mm diameter. None of the ones online seem to be that size. YouCut_20201225_111357891.mp4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 Question... What effect would low popping pressure have? All injectors were equal. Spray good. Detrimental or not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bondy Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 Hi I'vebeen pop testing my 100k plus miles injectors. some have good spray patern all popped at around 200p psi. l cleaned the nozzles with bad pattern, sprayed brake cleaner after and got good spray pattern, but on reassembly the spray pattern still poor? Any thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 New nozzles, suspect yours are a bit eroded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little mule Posted October 19, 2023 Share Posted October 19, 2023 Hi all the shims are for adjusting the pop off pressure . The 200 Tdi has two,stage injectors. The 300 Tdi has single stage injectors as far as I know and have ready I could be wrong , I have never seen or heard of two stage injectors on a 300 . If you look at a 200 injector you can see the physical size difference between the two and the number 4 injector is different than the other three do to having a sensor telling the ECU the engine is warmed up. the pop off pressure is 200 Bar which is 200x14.7(one atmosphere) = 2940PSI . If you can get them all to pop off at 2900 and have a really good spray pattern then you’re good to go . When I do a full engine rebuild I order new injectors from Bosch if I can’t find new complete Injectors I’ll order new tips and build a set of matching injectors . I’ll then know they are going to list a long time trouble free. I’ll even order new internal springs . My engine builder has a tester and shims to adjust the injector to the right pop off pressure. . Not matter how long the injectors have been on your shelf you should test them to check on the spray pattern and pop off pressure . the last set I had done my engine machine shop tested and adjusted them and installed a new set of injector tips that’s I provided . I know these are used injectors and I replace them with new ones but just on a complete rebuild . This way I know they are getting NEW injectors. My question to everyone is does anyone know the injector tip number for the Bosch injectors used in the international 2.8 and where can I buy either the tips or the complete injectors for the 2.8. I’ll buy new injectors if that’s all I can find but I have brand new injectors and I want to switch them to the 2.8 for more power . if they are the same part number as the 300 then I’ll be golden lol. I’m also looking for a part number and a place other than fourby to buy the boost pin and the boost ring kit to fit my 300 injection pump. I can’t find the part numbers anywhere . Fourby4x4 says they will sell me the injector tips for a 2.8 if I send mine over to the UK from Canada and they will install and test them . They won’t even give me the Bosch part number . I get it they have a shop to run . My problem is I live in Canada and the cost of shipping them back and forth across the other side of the pond is astronomical. They will also be returned to me if they are not super super clean . The diesel smell will set off the airport sensors lololol if I send over my brand new injectors to have the tips installed how do I know I’ll get the brand new ones back and not used ones rebuilt . Any help would be great thanks Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted October 19, 2023 Share Posted October 19, 2023 the 2.8 injector tips aren't actually the upgrade they seem to think they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little mule Posted October 19, 2023 Share Posted October 19, 2023 Good to know thanks LRF . Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted October 19, 2023 Share Posted October 19, 2023 My 200 and my 300 both have all four injectors on the respective engine identical to each other. Some 300s have an EDC pump and might have a special injector associated with it, but not the plain hydro mechanical pumps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peaklander Posted October 19, 2023 Share Posted October 19, 2023 Try these guys in Manchester UK I bought injectors for a Honda from them. https://www.pfjones.co.uk/bosch-diesel-agent.html Or these people, a little workshop in Sheffield. https://www.sheafdieselservices.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eightpot Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 On 10/19/2023 at 11:44 AM, Little mule said: If you look at a 200 injector you can see the physical size difference between the two and the number 4 injector is different than the other three do to having a sensor telling the ECU the engine is warmed up. 200tdi injectors are the same on all cylinders. Some automatic 300tdi engines have an ECU controlled fuel injection pump that takes data from engine sensors including injector number 4, which is the same as the other injectors except it has a small sensor to let the ecu know it has just fired. 300tdi injectors are also 2 stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little mule Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 Thanks eightpot. is it really worth to the change to the 2.8 injector tips and use the 300 body, tube,and spring . any improvements would be a plus Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobias Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 12 hours ago, Little mule said: Thanks eightpot. is it really worth to the change to the 2.8 injector tips and use the 300 body, tube,and spring . any improvements would be a plus Tony You should not change the injectors unless you are changing pistons to 2.8. The injectors sprav at an angle which is tailored to the swirl pot of the top of the piston. The 2.8 injectors have a smaller total hole diameter, so from a pure flow perspective, flow less fuel. T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little mule Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 Hi Tobias thanks for the advise is there any chance you might have the part numbers for the pistons , injectors, ? if you had a parts book that would be even better. I know the 2.8 was in the ford rangers in Spain but no one seems to have a parts book for the truck . And in English lol Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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