Off-topic threads

[JimAttrill]

I think a lounge would be an interesting proposal though, what it evolves into is anybodies guess but playing devils advocate the more cliquey it gets the less attractive it becomes for newcomers..

And I could (but won't) name two Land Rover forums where nearly all the posts are by the same old clique who all post OT rubbish to each other.

[bill van snorkle]

I don't know whether an OT/Chit Chat section would work on this forum or not, but occasionally even I, yes me! get a bit bored with strictly LandRover or 4x4 related topics and occasionally like to read about other subjects.Sometimes I am interested to learn the opinions of like minded people on a wide range of topics from Australia to Zimbabwe. last night for example I spent a couple of hours on the chit chat forum of Pirate reading all 15 pages of a thread on Global Warming from the perspective of 4x4 enthusiasts. Like most 4x4 enthusiasts if I get a cut I only bleed EP90 for a couple of minutes. After that I'm a normal person with a wide range of interests. Yes there are forums all over the net that cater to specific interests, and I do frequent a few, but I personally see no harm in having a reasonably moderated Chit Chat section for abit of releif from the serious business of keeping our POS nailed together.

Bill.

[protoprincess]

And I could (but won't) name two Land Rover forums where nearly all the posts are by the same old clique who all post OT rubbish to each other.

yep

[Big_John]

My 2p for what it's worth...

I think we should have a chat/Slightly OT section that is lightly moderated to allow the insurance/tax/fuel type stuff which personally I have found very handy (for example, saving £300 on my insurance), but to keep out anything slanderous/distasteful/downright drivel. Obviously this will lead to the 'what's the point of having an O/T section and then blocking stuff' discussion, very similar to this one, but hey, it's gotta be worth a try?

Incidently, another forum I was a member of (non-LR related) had a very similar issue and ended up losing a core of very strong members, much to the detriment of the forum in general. They also lost some complete muppets who lost their cool and got banned...no loss there!

Just for a bit of balance, I think the mods here do a great job and have helped make this place what it is - which is a fantastic technical reference and LR Oracle - and somewhere I wouldn't be afraid of my 7yr old son looking if he happened across the link to it. Unfortunately the same can't be said for much of the internet!

Thanks,

John

[Godlykepower]

Wow, I have deja-vu big time. I feel like I have read all this before a few weeks ago.

Blah-Blah, yawn......and so it goes round in never-ending circles.

Mods, how many times do we have to endure the pointless "lets have a chit-chat section or not" rubbish???

Can we either start one (which I personally dont want) or not please.

I thought we had all agreed from the last time this came up, that a certain amount of O/T banter was allowed to creep into relevant threads??

If that level has been exceeded, then just delete the threads you want if you see fit, without opening up a long-winded discussion thread such as this, where ultimately, nothing gets decided upon.

Now can we all please have a group hug & look forward to the weekend please!

[BigSi110]

And I could (but won't) name two Land Rover forums where nearly all the posts are by the same old clique who all post OT rubbish to each other.

And this thread is different eh? And it's being discussed TWICE!

Talk about 'if it ain't broke, fix it until it is'...

[sheeppimp]

I don't know I go away for a couple of days and I miss this.....

What happened to the Graveyard? - when I joined I seem to recall that these sort of threads ended up there (like recycle bin) - it cleared the main page in International and kept it nice and tidy

[Mo Murphy]

Seems to me that some people can't resist the opportunity to post on a thread they don't think should be there and so perpetuate it ! Odd !

If you don't think this thread is relevent then don't post on it and if everyone else agrees with you it will soon fall off the bottom of this page.

Mo

[JST]

Maybe there is some dis-agreement over which threds are too far off-topic, and maybe some comments could have been written more polite, however such dis-agreements does not need to turn into "wars", with people calling each others Hitlers (post 29183) and the like. Surely some of the messages from the admins could have been worded in a less provocative way; but then again - trying to maintain a technical focus on such a big website is quite a challenging task, and maybe the wording is chosen to reflect that...

on reflection this is where my 2 issues lie rather than with anything else and i think that issue is also picked up by others.

i don't think we need a separate forum, its something else to host and look after, the mods have enough to do and what if someone like Steve90 ended up being a mod to cover a chit chat forum - then we would all be doomed. :ph34r:

maybe the balance is out sometimes and spot on the rest of the time but the way you tell people that and then add that their responses make no difference is an interesting way of putting things and is bound to stir things up.

as we can see

[Steve 90]

Thanks mate James.

[JSG]

And I could (but won't) name two Land Rover forums where nearly all the posts are by the same old clique who all post OT rubbish to each other.

Maybe so Jim, but this forum could become one where all the posts are by the same old clique who all post tech questions to each other.

Just a thought....

[JSG]

Think we are now passing the " minimal percentage of the membership." you were on about Les

I'd add myself to this list I guess - I thought Reads90's post summed it up well.

Les, how about running a poll for five days to ask the membership which 'side of the fence' they are?

Might give you and the mod team a truer picture and a better understanding of what your membership wants.

[Steve King]

I think it is time to draw a line under this thread and mark it closed.

I see no reason for a poll to vote any moderator out. The Mods and Admin do a good job and we all want a Land Rover forum at the end of the day, so there must be moderation.

An O/T Section? Personally, I'd prefer not as it will get filled up will cr@p jokes that I heard in the fourth form (and that was a long time ago!!)

The degree of O/T that is allowed is and will always be subjective. Personally I think that car tax, fuel prices and insurance are always on-topic as they affect all UK members. Technical queries regarding non LR vehicles should be allowed because there is a vast wealth of knowledge on this forum, but once the query has been answered the thread has no real value to the forum as a whole and should be archived/deleted after a week or so.

Maybe a very slight relaxing of the rules is required taking the above into consideration?

Please let's not tear ourselves and the forum apart over this - please take it easy and restrain from being personal in your comments.

A well thought out humerous thread such as the Gigglepin Coms thread does no harm now and again and lightens the general mood.

Steve

[JST]

I see no reason for a poll to vote any moderator out. The Mods and Admin do a good job and we all want a Land Rover forum at the end of the day, so there must be moderation.

i agree, i dont think there is a need or requirement to vote in or out, remember we voted in to start with.

but we do want a LR forum that is not completely dry.

An O/T Section? Personally, I'd prefer not as it will get filled up will cr@p jokes that I heard in the fourth form (and that was a long time ago!!)

Steve

agreed

[ciderman]

what if someone like Steve90 ended up being a mod to cover a chit chat forum - then we would all be doomed. :ph34r:

Now that would be good , Got my vote

[Kim Horsevad]

(...)

maybe the balance is out sometimes and spot on the rest of the time but the way you tell people that and then add that their responses make no difference is an interesting way of putting things and is bound to stir things up.

(...)

Have you considered that these rather strongly worded responses from the forum admin might be an (albeit unsuccesfull) attempt to avoid a time-wasting 6 page long discussion whether the threads should be locked or not? I agree that the remarks in question _can_ be read as downright provocative; but they can also be read as an admin trying to steer the right course without stiring up a fuss about it....

[the_mouse_man]

/newbie chips in again but risks being accused of sucking up to teacher/

I think if we take this thread right back to where it came from and re read one of Les' original posts,

"When the percentage of off-topic threads gets too high, then they will be removed or locked.

One or two of these are worse than others, but to avoid complaints about individualism - they will be locked. These threads have had a fair run, so I'm being reasonable I think.

This type of off-topic subject has been posted several times before and still people dilute the content. You can moan all you like, but they will be gone shortly."

We can debate the subsequent response (and you did) but I don't think any of this was about not allowing OT posts (including his own) - but it was (IMHO) about capping them when the proportion gets too high......on reflection seems reasonable to me.

/newbie steps back and buts out/

[Steve King]

/newbie chips in again but risks being accused of sucking up to teacher/

I think if we take this thread right back to where it came from and re read one of Les' original posts,

"When the percentage of off-topic threads gets too high, then they will be removed or locked.

One or two of these are worse than others, but to avoid complaints about individualism - they will be locked. These threads have had a fair run, so I'm being reasonable I think.

This type of off-topic subject has been posted several times before and still people dilute the content. You can moan all you like, but they will be gone shortly."

We can debate the subsequent response (and you did) but I don't think any of this was about not allowing OT posts (including his own) - but it was (IMHO) about capping them when the proportion gets too high......on reflection seems reasonable to me.

/newbie steps back and buts out/

Seems reasonable to me too! In the absence of a let's make up and be friendly thread can we all call it a day?

Steve

[JST]

also be read as an admin trying to steer the right course without stiring up a fuss about it....

without stirring up a fuss, then leave it as, say they will be locked and thats that, not add regardless of what the members want s*d you.

As i said i have no issue with the tidy up (perhaps some the topics i do consider On To rather than Off) but its the way its communicated - similar to nearly everything else in the world. People like to feel that their opinions count for something. if that wasnt the case you wouldnt have this thread.

[Happyoldgit]

without stirring up a fuss, then leave it as, say they will be locked and thats that, not add regardless of what the members want s*d you.

As i said i have no issue with the tidy up (perhaps some the topics i do consider On To rather than Off) but its the way its communicated - similar to nearly everything else in the world. People like to feel that their opinions count for something. if that wasnt the case you wouldnt have this thread.

I do not disagree with any of that.

I will also add that what with Billing and a number of A&M's being away at present there is not likely to be a great deal of input from that quarter just now.

[V8 Freak]

Well......

I've read most of this thread a few times now and I need to say it's just making me feel quite angry....

I can't believe the Mods and Admin are letting this thread continue. It should have been an inform of a decision and then closed. Not a position for debate.

The fact that Les acted in a very polite manner and advised that O/T threads were becoming too frequent and would be closed down, is more than he needed to do. Even today there is someone asking for help with their CV, and it's not the type you can get from Ashcroft. For carp like that Google is your friend.. It is not related to Land Rover in any way. This is not a place for general chat about a load of topics not LR related......

Bog off to Facebook for carp like that.

No-one "forced" any of you to participate here. You all came here of your own free will.

You all freely choose to contribute, read or generally hang around but most importantly, by signing up to LR4X4 you agreed to abide by the Forum Charter. Do not expect things to change because it's not LRO or LRA without the aims of this forum.

It's quite clear;

"Forum values

This forum has been established to provide an independent and open place for discussing and sharing information and activities relating to Land Rovers and related subjects."

and....

"Rules and regulations

Rules and regulations have deliberately been kept simple and have been left to 'common sense' rather than trying to itemise them in minute detail........

As this is a Land Rover forum members are expected to keep the majority of their posts about Land Rovers or subjects closely associated with them, their use, repair or modification. Some off topic posts are acceptable but in this case the post title should begin with the letters 'OT' as an indication that they are not Land Rover related. Land Rover related threads sometimes wander off topic but they are generally still regarded as being on topic."

The Mods and Admin have left a good level of friendly banter in the threads and allowed them to drift off topic when the genuine request / info has been satisfied. OT threads do occur, some that will help Land Rover / 4X4 drivers and I believe that to date a reasonable level has been found / managed by the Mods. Respect them for what they have done, giving their time freely to make this a great place for information, banter, and opportunity to meet like minded people.

With over 8000 members topics will re-appear and at times seem repetitive, but that's going to be the new people doing what others have over the 3 years. Live with it, help them, or maybe point them to the search facility !

At the risk of getting myself banned.... Admin / Mods... Sort it out.

Decide on what "some" looks like and then anything else not Land Rover / Off road related, modifications, fabrication / technical or of use to other participants should be deleted. No debate.

Everyone can still freely choose to come here but if you don't like what the forum stands for, just pi$$ off and go moan somewhere else.

Neil

[Milemarker Type S]

You can moan all you like, but they will be gone shortly.

My 2p... not sure what that is worth now with all this inflation...

Sorry back to the point...

It was not what was said... It was the way that it was said Les. I am not sure if you intended to be so blunt- having text only can lead to things being misread?

If the majority of of the mods think something is too off topic then yes bin it... but if it is just one persons opinion then I think that it may be a little unfair... Some stuff is blatantly not for this site (I won't name specific ones cos they are fairly obvious...) others are very much open to interpretation- tax/ insurance etc...

A little OT makes the world go around- we are all guilty of it on occassion (some more than others as has already been highlighted) An awful lot of us know each other in real life as well- we dont spend all our time discussing Land Rovers when we get together (we sometimes mention Jeeps as well! )

For what its worth I dont see the need for an OT section... it only encourages the riff raff

[Happyoldgit]

Ok I'm locking this thread now - the reason being that it is going round and round in circles.

Thanks for the input. All the concerns that have been raised have been raised and are now being discussed in A&M but as I already said several mods are away so it will be a few days before we have a full compliment again.

Any problems PM me although I really don't have anything further to add at present.