Hmmmm - What does the panel think about this ?....

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

OK

Me + Big tuned V8 = F Hot

Std V8 Factory has a 7 bladed Viscous Fan, Hot 'Wogonia' countries had a 11 Bladed option

11 Bladed option costs a fortune and yet I found one at Old Sodbury

and, as my water pump is currently nacked and a replacement new QH one sitting on the bench

for fitting , I have thought about the 7 to 11 blade conversion

Prob is the Viscous is different on both, and a 11 blade one is a fortune (and even werider listed

as the same part number in some places - and I know its not the mounting points for the fan blade are

completely different) OD of the 7 and 11 is the same its the centre / mounting pattern that different

so, the question is

If I made up a thin spacer (lets say 4mm ) and thus bolted the 11 blade to a 7 blade viscous,

other than the fan blades being 4mm further forward than std (not an issue) anyone see if there

are any other likley probs - ie with the operation of the viscous ?

Thoughts please ?

Nige

[steve_d]

Fit electric fans.

You then cool when it's needed and can switch them off when playing in water so you don't throw it all over the engine.

Steve

[landkeeper]

there are two spare 11 blade jobs with viscuos units sitting on my bench at the mo

1 is yours for the price of a few pints if you want one !

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

Thanks, but they I know will have a very different fitting in terms on forward / backward 'positioing'

the V8s are very very veeeery odd.

Hence my thoughts re fitting via the 'work' suggested.

I also already have 2x 14 inch kenlowes, and a 6 row Hi-flo Gillet core 4x vents in wings

etc etc etc etc ..... and it still gets F hot (yes an oil cooler is on the cards as well )

What I am unsure about is if the various viscous units just have different positoning / PCDs

etc or if the extra blades / resistances etc will have any 'impact' with the internal working of the viscous ?

Nige

[western]

Nige

my 110 1987 on parts book shows 7 [ETC7553L] & 11 [ERC8164 optional] blade fans using the same Viscous unit ERC5708

both fans use 4 bolts to viscous unit & 4 bolts viscous to pulley.

[bishbosh]

I can't see it being a problem.

[Turbocharger]

I have to ask if the rad is cooling effectively, if you're still having problems with more fans than a Rolling Stones reunion gig.

[ciderman]

Yep it does sound like you may be masking the problem Nige with all these fans .

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

No, the problem is a 3.5 block bored to make 4.5 and 'Big Love-ing BHP'

Alls well when moving but when jammed in solid somewhere, esp deep mud etc and make

the engine work really hard ....and with no / low moving air flow / stationary ..............

the core temp can jump.....and fast, keeping it under control and getting it back down is

"Interesrting" ...........and has taken a while

The rad is a 6 row gillet core, before I had this it would overheat and blow

it guts out, the fans help, but an oil cooler is on the cards, this is just a great

opportunity to have yet another 'tweak', the 11 and 7 blade fans don't have

the same viscous even tho your manual / microcat says thats so,.... I know

I have done a S*** Load of rersearch on this .....inc ring LR tech ......

.....and the viscous is different ....I was given and have somewhere the correct part number.....

but.............. its NLFA ... FFS

I have now 'just about' got the engine heats under control, 'just about' being the key words

.......its touch and go on a steaming hot day when stuck, winching and giving it RPM,.... so the

11 blade conversion + Proposed new Oil cooler is more to increase the keeping it under control

90% of the time is fine, when I first had it - it is wasn't ........................price of BHP and Torque

in what was a engine 1000 cc designed smaller than what I have, and thats before the tweaks on top of the CC

Nige

[landkeeper]

ok but they worked fine on a 4.6 setup in a defender in kuwait the 11 blade job has an entirely different viscous unit to its smaller brother i can take some pics if you like

[jules]

Just a small point car elecy fans are great but LR's weigh a bit more and demand a little more from the cooling system "If electric fans were any good Rande Rover's, Discovery's and Defenders would have them fitted at the factory and LR would not wast money on the Viscous ones would they all have"

Nigel

I was out in Dubai last year in the 40+ degree heat dessert in a 25 yr old 3.9 RRC FIA racer servicing and case car back up for a 4.2 RRC FIA racer both cars only had the factory cooling set up and neither suffered any cooling problems at all the racer would get turned off at about 6pm and would would be working on it well into the small hours and the plenum was still too hot to touch even after several hours so there was no ambient cooling at all. but the 3.9 we were basically living out of has AC and that car would not get turned off all day even as we sat waiting at the service points and that could be for four or five ours the temp gauge never moved I must admit I was shocked at how stable both cars cooling systems worked in the desert heat both me and my co-driver were melting but we were laughing about how our racers would over heat at the drop of a hat in the UK but the very over loaded classic we had when we were lost in the dunes for best part of a day and was being worked very very hard still the temp never moved so there is nothing wrong with the factory design on the I think they call it Saudi spec LR's

[SteveRK]

I'm assuming you have four branch manifolds with insulating wadding - this being the case then its might be a case of 'trapping' heat in the system rather then letting it conduct into the engine bay?

Positioning of fans is likely to be important in a series engine bay as its very cramped.

a radical option is to fit bonnet vents - manually adjustable so they can be closed for wading etc. and try removing the wadding at the joints on the manifolds with the cylinder heads to try and get the heat away & upwards?

When the rad's up to temperature the fans will be washing the engine with hot air so the heat differential will be minimal between the engine and air temp' further reducing heat dissipation?

Only ideas - not science mind you but i think it comes down to being able to replenish the engine bay air sufficiently often to ged rid of the heat that is building up

[Boothy]

Nige.

I got myself an enormous big dual 1" core Alloy radiator from Summit racing in the US of A and hey ho end of cooling problems, they are suposed to be more than 40% more efficent at cooling, stuck a 16" Pacet profan on her and "it don't get hot no more boss" and that's still the case now the rads on the rear out of the airflow alltogether.

The Summit racing rad was £200 and on the doorstep in 3 days, that'sbetter than most UK dealers,it was meant for a Chevy 5.7 litre racing engine, orsomething similar, Alleysports quoted me nearly £600 if I remember correctly.

It still cools well when when it's sat in mud for ages digging away and winching hard, which if you remember is what can make a V8 get very very warm, when they're still and wrapped in mud.

Good luck pal.

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

the 11 blade job has an entirely different viscous unit to its smaller brother i can take some pics if you like

^^

Yes please - go on and depress me

[western]

viscous hubs

ERR4996

ERC2849

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

Just a small point car elecy fans are great but LR's weigh a bit more and demand a little more from the cooling system "If electric fans were any good Rande Rover's, Discovery's and Defenders would have them fitted at the factory and LR would not wast money on the Viscous ones would they all have"

Nigel

I was out in Dubai last year in the 40+ degree heat dessert in a 25 yr old 3.9 RRC FIA racer servicing and case car back up for a 4.2 RRC FIA racer both cars only had the factory cooling set up and neither suffered any cooling problems at all the racer would get turned off at about 6pm and would would be working on it well into the small hours and the plenum was still too hot to touch even after several hours so there was no ambient cooling at all. but the 3.9 we were basically living out of has AC and that car would not get turned off all day even as we sat waiting at the service points and that could be for four or five ours the temp gauge never moved I must admit I was shocked at how stable both cars cooling systems worked in the desert heat both me and my co-driver were melting but we were laughing about how our racers would over heat at the drop of a hat in the UK but the very over loaded classic we had when we were lost in the dunes for best part of a day and was being worked very very hard still the temp never moved so there is nothing wrong with the factory design on the I think they call it Saudi spec LR's

^^^

Agree with all of the above, ...........

but

an FIA Racer LR is very different to me stuck up to me hubs trapping air flow from getting out underneath,

plus a engine that is 'somwhat'F High Compression, Ultra Big Valved, over bored over stroked, and prob

slightly on the mad side power wise vs what the block was deisgned for,

the combo of this and being stationary / stuck is very different to its prev life in a comp racer

where it may have had the naggers revved off it but it was also moving like the clappers and

thus had air flow, even the exghaust mods helped cool it with the BL DAKAR Big Bore Cast Headers

I have considered an ali rad as they can dump heat far better than a trad one, but 11 vs 7 plus cooler

is a cheap route to try, just wnat to know if the viscous won't do it job ?

But ta for the thoughts and ideas all - as I said its OK now most of the time, but not all ..........and thats me target

Nige

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

Nige.

I got myself an enormous big dual 1" core Alloy radiator from Summit racing in the US of A and hey ho end of cooling problems, they are suposed to be more than 40% more efficent at cooling, stuck a 16" Pacet profan on her and "it don't get hot no more boss" and that's still the case now the rads on the rear out of the airflow alltogether.

The Summit racing rad was £200 and on the doorstep in 3 days, that'sbetter than most UK dealers,it was meant for a Chevy 5.7 litre racing engine, orsomething similar, Alleysports quoted me nearly £600 if I remember correctly.

It still cools well when when it's sat in mud for ages digging away and winching hard, which if you remember is what can make a V8 get very very warm, when they're still and wrapped in mud.

Good luck pal.

Gotta Linky / Part number / WxDxH / Piccies Dear ?

Nige

[Mark90]

Another vote for a big ally rad. Oil cooler will help too, suprised you haven't already got one. Should have bought that 11 blade fan off me last year

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

OIL Cooler was sh***d on the engine when I got it, should have replaced it prob

at the rebuild stage, but disn't due to time / costs / praying

Ali rad is a poss, Oil coller is defo on the books, 11 blade RR fan units / viscouses

or is that viscousi are toatlly differewnt in where they end up within the cowling

the 11 blade V8 110 unit is rare as a are thing, but I keep looking

to get the fan was a result, there was some prob with the factory on these, the part

number if you order it (visc) means the wrong bit turns up (tried) the RR one is no use

and the V8 110 11 Blade one wasn't on anything else

So, anyone think that there could be a prob with the internal resistances of the extra blades meaning the

7 blade viscous may not work quite right / same on a 11 blade "Conversion" ?

Nige

[dirkthe1]

if its just the mounting hubs that are different it should be alright-or have i mis read that?

[MJIbex]

Ali rad is a poss,

Nige, I make it a definate! Sorted my cooling problems in one hit. Last winch challenge I did went all morning with 2x blown fuses for the electric fans without getting noticeably hot; I hadn't noticed until the last punch before lunch.

Before the alisport rad it would struggle to stay cool with the fans running continously. Now the fans are hardly taxed; when on auto just do a 10-20 second blast and drop the temp and switch off again. Any driving between punches and the temp just drops straight back to thermostat switch level.

Mark

[Bush65]

...

If I made up a thin spacer (lets say 4mm ) and thus bolted the 11 blade to a 7 blade viscous,

other than the fan blades being 4mm further forward than std (not an issue) anyone see if there

are any other likley probs - ie with the operation of the viscous ?

Thoughts please ?

Nige

Just do it. But ensure the spacer disc has a large hole in the centre so the hot air can flow onto the viscous hub.

Then report the results back here.

[HoggyN]

Is the current fan shrouded? We've done some comparative testing at work, shrouded vs unshrouded, and shrouded was significantly better. So much so that we considered running with just one fan instead of two.

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

Yep

The specially made rad has the V8 Cowling to suit the Viscous

Shrouds make a HUGE differenrce, as does blocking up areas where air can bypass going through

the rad etc....its the engine that causes the issues, but the ali rad is very interesting

Boothy - are you F there ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ??

Nige

[Roverdrive]

IIRC the 101 has the 11 bade fan.

Can't remember if it was a metal or plastic one.

It was the same fixing as the standard RRC, and looked to be a similar size, so the additional torque shouldn't be an issue (????)

Good Luck