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Weighing bits of Land Rover


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No experience...

But what about using a weigh bridge.... Once apron a time whilst living in Norwich the local tip had a weigh bridge with some very friendly gentlemen who proved helpful when I had landrover weight curiosities one quiet Saturday afternoon...

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Couple of trips back and forth?

Do you think the engine and transmission weights are THAT important? Let's face it it's not land speed record territory and with speed it's not so much weight that's the problem but aerodynamics

Wheels and tires yes weight is an issue but it's rotational inertia that's the problem not just weight by its self. Matt Lee use to do a very nice set of two and three piece aluminium rims that looked very nice at reducing rotational inertia but not sure if they still do them for reasonable money

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Couple of trips back and forth?

Do you think the engine and transmission weights are THAT important? Let's face it it's not land speed record territory and with speed it's not so much weight that's the problem but aerodynamics

Wheels and tires yes weight is an issue but it's rotational inertia that's the problem not just weight by its self. Matt Lee use to do a very nice set of two and three piece aluminium rims that looked very nice at reducing rotational inertia but not sure if they still do them for reasonable money

Every little helps, mostly its for my own amusement. Weight IS important and where possible I am trying to remove it without compromising reliability. I will be using a non-LR engine and gearbox so being able to make comparisons is useful.

Know what 'each' thing weighs will help by showing exactly where all the weight is in the overall vehicle. Less weight the better.

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I use a weighing pallet truck that work have or the hoist which has a weight indicator built in but neither are cheap.

2 ways I can think k to do it on the cheap.

If you can get something that you know the weight of like a block of concrete or whatever you can find attach the concrete to one end of a beam and the thing you want to weigh at the other end. Pick it all up with one fork of the forklift. Shuffle side to side where you pick it up. Once it's balanced if you measure from the middle to both ends you can calculate the weight.

Have a beam with one end on the floor and the other on some domestic scales. Depending where you put the thing you want to weigh on the beam you can again measure and calculate the weight.

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I don't know how accurate you need it but if you get a spring of known rate (like a land rover spring, there's a list somewhere on this website and they're cheap) hang the item off it with the forklift, measure if before and after and calculate from that?

After all that's all a spring balance is.

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When I was ready to get springs made for my Disco I loaded it up as if I was going on a trip into the bush, filled the 90 litre water tank and 135 litre fuel tank etc. and toddled along to the nearest RTA (NSW Roads & Transport Agency) Inspection station where trucks over 8 tonnes are obliged by law to drive into for roadworthiness and drivers log book inspections (do you have similar places in the UK?) anyway they happily weighed the Disco by putting scales under each wheel, this enabled me to go to a coil spring maker and have custom progressive springs made for the car at its maximum touring weight. They increase the ride height by about 20mm when unloaded otherwise cope with all the socking corrugations that our bush roads can throw at them and are IMHO far better then the standard springs.

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I haven't got a picture of one we made, but get a LR bottle jack.

From below, in the very centre, drill and tap a 1/8 bsp. Plumb this into a gauge of your choice - voila - you now have an hydraulic jack scale.

This is the table i came up with, using a 1.25" bore. This is when the small part of the ram isn't extended, only the thicker one. (LR jacks are telescoping)

post-9903-0-07274800-1427496664_thumb.jpg

Edit : it's not a simple task of copying a spreadsheet from excel onto the forum !

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Actually rereading your first post, you have a forklift.

Just make a system by which you put a hook on the bottom of an hydraulic cylinder. The smaller the diameter, the higher the pressure range - you'll have to work out what sort of weights you wish to weigh. Using the above spreadsheet a piston area of 1.22 sq in, you can weight up to 2,000kg attaining about 3600 Psi.

Remember you'll have to factor in the area of the piston's rod because you'll be pulling down on it.

G

Picture from google :

http://shagbarkfarms.com/public/Sawmill//HangingScales/

HangingScales2.JPG

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bathroom scales is all I use and a fish weight spring measure. about 50 kg for a simex tyre and wheel from memory. I weighed a 300 tdi in seperate bits on it as well (bathroom sale does about 100 kg). Keep it simple I'd say. And yes, weight is important.

Daan

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bathroom scales is all I use and a fish weight spring measure. about 50 kg for a simex tyre and wheel from memory. I weighed a 300 tdi in seperate bits on it as well (bathroom sale does about 100 kg). Keep it simple I'd say. And yes, weight is important.

Daan

Your 88 is my inspiration Daan.... although mine won't be as light at yours!

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Curious why so many feel weight is so important?

Must admit when I rebuilt my axles I was very surprised in the weight of a fully dressed axle?

Plus galv chassis was well in excess of what the oem one was (I could lift the oem one (just) but the galv one I tried and failed)

Problem is I could not see what could be done to reduce the weight of these three key major components (please someone don't suggest turning the chassis into Swiss cheese!!! ...there was a chassis in LRO looking like Swiss cheese)

Rotational inertia that is another matter and I agree 100% but non rotational components I remain unconvinced that it's that significant an issue, but as the stapline below always willing to learn another viewpoint

The thing I found with the 90 was that at certain speeds the front end seemed to get a bit light, and in part I think that I blamed on the swing away spare wheel plus a wolf rim overhang and that was with a weight of ~1775kg (soft top 90) and I did wonder if relocating the spare to the bonnet would have improved the situation?

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Daan has hit the nail bang on this is how we used to weigh my brothers race car. He bought 6 identical bathroom scales we put a board across two for each front wheel then reset them to zero. We then jacked the car up an end at a time and placed the doubled up scales under the front wheels and singles under the back. This gave us corner weights (the suspension was then adjusted to the required weight) but for total just add all the weights together. We were weighing a car that was just shy of 600kg. The only things we took care with were we used digital scales (about £5 for up to 300kg) and you may need to shift positions to get similar readings on all scales (more accurate if all scales are within a few kgs).

Mike

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Curious why so many feel weight is so important?

Must admit when I rebuilt my axles I was very surprised in the weight of a fully dressed axle?

Plus galv chassis was well in excess of what the oem one was (I could lift the oem one (just) but the galv one I tried and failed)

Problem is I could not see what could be done to reduce the weight of these three key major components (please someone don't suggest turning the chassis into Swiss cheese!!! ...there was a chassis in LRO looking like Swiss cheese)

Rotational inertia that is another matter and I agree 100% but non rotational components I remain unconvinced that it's that significant an issue, but as the stapline below always willing to learn another viewpoint

The thing I found with the 90 was that at certain speeds the front end seemed to get a bit light, and in part I think that I blamed on the swing away spare wheel plus a wolf rim overhang and that was with a weight of ~1775kg (soft top 90) and I did wonder if relocating the spare to the bonnet would have improved the situation?

In my opinion, weight should be top of anyones list. Yes a landrover axle is so heavy, it bends light. Is that a reason to add more? Commonly, people like to fit alloys to a defender these days, for reasons of it looking racey? Did anyone ever compare the weight of alloy wheels with steel? If you did, you would think twice about fitting them. Interesting you mention the chassis; most galvanized chassis are 3 mm thick, rather than 2 mm as standard> 50% heavier. At least a marsland chassis is using a standard chassis to begin with, so should be lighter. And if you can weigh it, you know where you stand.

It is an almost thankless task to try to make people understand this, I must admit. Loads of people have their engines tuned, to give, say 10% more power. But I know very few who try to remove 10% from the cars weight. The last solution is much better and more reliable.

Just some idle mumblings...

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I just use a set of heavy duty hanging scales (think the ones I have go up to 200kg), for very heavy stuff I hang them off my engine crane and then use that to pick up said heavy item. I think they are fairly accurate but you could weigh a known weight (eg bag of cement) to be sure.

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Thanks Daan for taking the time, I agree with you 100% about adding 10% power and forgetting about weight plus aerodynamics

I had a set of wolf rims on mine with 265/75/16 ATs and was surprised by the rotational inertia effect at speed (flywheel effect)

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Richards chassis (as mine is) are made from 2.5mm steel.

The way I'm looking at it is, I'm adding weight in the form of winches/bumper/wheels/tyres. If I can do anything to offset those weights, it's a bonus. Whether that's remaking something from a different material or finding a design change to loose some weight it will be an advantage. Less weight the better as a 90SW starts around 1800kg and MGW is 2400kg, I've only got 600kg to play with, and straight away if I get in it I've lost 100kg of payload.

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