thibauts Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Hi all, I am thinking of putting a vnt turbo on my discovery 300tdi engine. I would like to put a Garrett GT2052V turbo from an Audi A6 2,5 v6 engine. I heard these turbo's can be used on land rover engine with some adjusting? Has anyone ever (successfully) put a turbo like that on a 300tdi engine? What modifications are necessary? I heard a discovery 200tdi exhaust manifold could be plug and play? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uninformed Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 (edited) is the vnt pressure or vacuum activated? Edited January 21, 2017 by uninformed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Member Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 10 hours ago, uninformed said: is the vnt pressure or vacuum activated? It would be simple to change a vacuum actuator to a pressure actuator. They are cheap to buy new. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 The audi will have had an electronic control system with a solenoid in the system before the (pressure) actuator. My 1.9tdi certainly does. Don't forget that it uses the vanes for boost control, not just to improve the spool at low end with what essentially amounts to variable A/R (there is no waste gate), and I suspect a non linear relationship between boost and ideal vane position, or there would be little point in the control system. I've seen a few people claim to have done VNT conversions, but none with any technical detail beyond a scant "oh, slap on this actuator that happens to fit. Works great" that leaves you wondering if it really works that well, or even better than what was there originally.... Don't let me put you off, I think this would be a great project if done well (more than bolting it up and hoping for the best). Looks like that garret has a good shot at bolting up to the 200tdi manifold - certainly the same shape. Order up a gasket from each to check? Those audi turbos are plentiful and cheap. Controlling it to get the best out of it is the real challenge, though. Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Member Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 No, that is not quite right. They use vacuum control. The vanes are open until boost is desired, it then closes them as much as possible to achieve the requested boost. It is nothing complicated. You can use a simple direct pressure actuator just like the 2.8. It works fine. You lose some efficiency when off boost, but I doubt it is measurable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thibauts Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 Hello, The turbo's i am looking at are vacuum controlled. Will have a look into the iveco turbo's as the audi turbo only fits with a defender 200Tdi exhaust manifold apparantly. https://plus.google.com/photos/112012783108056418001/albums/5434753789820442705?banner=pwa#photos/112012783108056418001/albums/5434753789820442705 Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 19 hours ago, thibauts said: Hello, The turbo's i am looking at are vacuum controlled. Will have a look into the iveco turbo's as the audi turbo only fits with a defender 200Tdi exhaust manifold apparantly. https://plus.google.com/photos/112012783108056418001/albums/5434753789820442705?banner=pwa#photos/112012783108056418001/albums/5434753789820442705 Thanks! You got me looking at this - and it does look like the audi would fit the defender manifold, but the position of the actuator would make it too high to close the bonnet by the look of it. How easy would it be to relocate the actuator? Also, hopefully relevant to this thread, I had assumed the stock 200tdi turbo is pressure actuated. So whats involved in converting a vacuum operated turbo to a pressure actuated one? Just changing the actuator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carloz Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hangover Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 The GT2052V is also found on the 3ltr nissan ZD30 without any electronics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Member Posted January 26, 2017 Share Posted January 26, 2017 23 hours ago, hangover said: The GT2052V is also found on the 3ltr nissan ZD30 without any electronics. That version seems to have the wrong manifold flange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 26, 2017 Share Posted January 26, 2017 On 21/01/2017 at 9:22 PM, Red90 said: No, that is not quite right. They use vacuum control. The vanes are open until boost is desired, it then closes them as much as possible to achieve the requested boost. It is nothing complicated. You can use a simple direct pressure actuator just like the 2.8. It works fine. You lose some efficiency when off boost, but I doubt it is measurable. That's not what I'd heard, I was under the impression the geometry was a bit more complex and there was a risk of stalling the compressor in certain configurations. The TGV 2.8 works OK with a dumb actuator but is by no means perfect. Most I've seen use a PWM controlled solenoid the vary vacuum on the actuator, a controller would be the work of moments with a small microcontroller board and a driver circuit connected to a PWM pin. The hard part would be mapping the required boost/geometry across the load/revs/throttle range. The TD4 Freelander uses the PWM solenoid method, the same part# actuates the EGR valve and crops up on TD5's too so an easy pick from the parts bin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Member Posted January 26, 2017 Share Posted January 26, 2017 2 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said: That's not what I'd heard, I was under the impression the geometry was a bit more complex and there was a risk of stalling the compressor in certain configurations. Not with a diesel. They are complicated to control on a petrol. Diesel control is very basic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GW8IZR Posted January 26, 2017 Share Posted January 26, 2017 Would this be as simple as measure MAP, RPM and throttle position, when the pedal is in a low demand position and engine near idle set the boost control to allow it to spin up easily, show some pedal and then just move actuator to give max boost - beyond maximum boost start to move the actuator back to maintain maximum. As said above that would be easy to code (I think) ? I looked at a 4cyl BMW turbo setup and whilst post EU4 they used an electric actuator before that the same setup just appears to use a vac boost actuator controlled by a vac switch giving none proportional on/off control. (edit) thinking about that it seems wrong as I cant see any method of progressively limiting boost such as a wastegate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Member Posted January 26, 2017 Share Posted January 26, 2017 Yes, that is basically it. But it seems silly adding all this complexity to an engine that has none, for little gain. If you were putting it on a TD5, then it would make sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hangover Posted January 26, 2017 Share Posted January 26, 2017 21 hours ago, Red90 said: That version seems to have the wrong manifold flange. Nothing a bit of 10mm plate wont fix, otherwise an Iveco 2060V has the same flange but uses studs so either the manifold or the turbo will need to be drill out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffordtdi Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 So, has anyone ever successfully done this conversation using a 2052v? I like the idea of it for mine, but if controlling it is virtually impossible then there isn't much point in the effort? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudmonkey Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 Also interested in any more info on this. I know a place with a scrap V6 A6 in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudmonkey Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 After a little research I've come up with some ramblings, as I understand it there are two simple-ish ways to do this. Either using a turbo controller such as a Digibooster, the kit all in is £165. Or convert to boost controlled, I found some universal boost actuators online which come with a selection of springs which would be useful to tune the vanes since I can't find anyone that has fitted an "off the shelf" actuator. The actuators are around £70 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffordtdi Posted October 16, 2017 Share Posted October 16, 2017 14 hours ago, Mudmonkey said: After a little research I've come up with some ramblings, as I understand it there are two simple-ish ways to do this. Either using a turbo controller such as a Digibooster, the kit all in is £165. Or convert to boost controlled, I found some universal boost actuators online which come with a selection of springs which would be useful to tune the vanes since I can't find anyone that has fitted an "off the shelf" actuator. The actuators are around £70 That's worth knowing! Someone told me that you can swap the actuator and use the standard tsi item with a bit of fettling. Not sure if this has even been done to prove the theory though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudmonkey Posted October 19, 2017 Share Posted October 19, 2017 (edited) This is the way that the Patrol guys bypass the ECU control on their 3.0 engines using the same turbo. Looks like a cheap and easy way to plumb the turbo onto a 300tdi Further development reading here Edited October 19, 2017 by Mudmonkey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GORI V8 Posted August 2, 2020 Share Posted August 2, 2020 Hi, did anyone end up using a GT2052V in the end? I am about to go this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted January 30, 2021 Share Posted January 30, 2021 Looks like they didn’t .... let us know how you get on ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudmonkey Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 Not yet, maybe next year! 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callum200tdi Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 On 8/2/2020 at 7:12 PM, GORI V8 said: Hi, did anyone end up using a GT2052V in the end? I am about to go this way. I’m currently going this way as I already had a gt2052v in going with a universal waste gate controller with different spring pressure and mounting the actuator on the opposite side to push vanes open rather than pull hope this helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 1 hour ago, Callum200tdi said: I’m currently going this way as I already had a gt2052v in going with a universal waste gate controller with different spring pressure and mounting the actuator on the opposite side to push vanes open rather than pull hope this helps Very interested to see the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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