Boge levelling unit in a STW

[western]

I seem to remember someone on here got a unit repaired 

[western]

reb78 looked at reconditioned units 

 

[reb78]

On 7/4/2023 at 6:03 PM, western said:

reb78 looked at reconditioned units 

 

Yeah - I tried but if you read to the end, I gave up. The recon one spat its oil out everywhere. The place that were looking at it for me were miles away and I just couldnt donate the time to the project as i needed the 110 on the road reliably. The TD5 progressive springs have been absolutely fine to be honest. I wouldnt hesitate to suggest just using them instead - especially given the ludicrous prices some companies want to recon the original Boge strut... the ride was nice but it wasnt worth what they are asking. 

[uninformed]

I have the BOGE pdf in my computer somewhere, I’ll link it if I can find it.

Springs alone will never replace or do the same job of springs + Boge Load Leveller 

They are certainly serviceable and I’m very surprised there aren’t a few places in the UK doing them that aren’t bespoke (roll eyes) jobs. We can get them rebuilt here in Australia.

 

 

 

[Sigi_H]

I know the Boges from BMW Motorcycles. They have always been perfect, but never cheap. Springs are a lot cheaper.

[uninformed]

Not specifically our RRC/LRload levellers but its the principle

 

Sach's info (load leveller).pdf

[Simon Smith]

When mine failed I fitted Puma 110 SW springs, can't say I've noticed the ride is any harder than before, but it sits a little higher unladen. 

[Sigi_H]

In 1992 Boge and Sachs merged. Now it is part of ZF Friedrichshafen. The principle remains, but our self leveler has a separate high pressure tank. If there is a diaphragm in that tank, its over when it is gone.

Thanks for the PDF

Sigi

Edited July 7, 2023 by Sigi_H

[uninformed]

26 minutes ago, Sigi_H said:

In 1992 Boge and Sachs merged. Now it is part of ZF Friedrichshafen. The principle remains, but our self leveler has a separate high pressure tank. If there is a diaphragm in that tank, its over when it is gone.

Thanks for the PDF

Sigi

The RRC did not have the separate tank, the 110s did. 

[reb78]

3 hours ago, Sigi_H said:

In 1992 Boge and Sachs merged. Now it is part of ZF Friedrichshafen. The principle remains, but our self leveler has a separate high pressure tank. If there is a diaphragm in that tank, its over when it is gone.

Thanks for the PDF

Sigi

I was told there is a diapragm when I looked into this.

[FridgeFreezer]

Makes me wonder if one of the aftermarket bling shock companies could build up a shock as a self-leveller, seems they share a lot of basic parts just perhaps assembled in slightly different order.

[uninformed]

4 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

Makes me wonder if one of the aftermarket bling shock companies could build up a shock as a self-leveller, seems they share a lot of basic parts just perhaps assembled in slightly different order.

Absolutely especially given it’s already been done (something to copy) but it’s probably not economical given the realistic market. But since ZF can rebuild them, parts exist and there are definitely people who could rebuild them. Just a shame the whole “bespoke” thing has got out of hand. 
 

I was going to run one on my 110 but in the end I wasn’t sure it would handle the axle travel. If I was building a stock height RRC I’d definitely run one 

[Sigi_H]

It is not rocket science. I remember when i did my Citroen shocks 25 years ago. The problem where plain bearings in silentblocks I had to lathe and the Teflon seals

Nothing was to buy, so I had to build it myself

[FridgeFreezer]

11 hours ago, uninformed said:

but it’s probably not economical given the realistic market.

Depends - if it can be achieved with mostly off-the-shelf rebuildable shock parts and a few minor tweaks / mods it could be a lot cheaper than £900+ for a rebuilt one.

[uninformed]

1 hour ago, FridgeFreezer said:

Depends - if it can be achieved with mostly off-the-shelf rebuildable shock parts and a few minor tweaks / mods it could be a lot cheaper than £900+ for a rebuilt one.

Going by the physical size alone it’s not going to be cheap. Have a look at the price of the bigger dia shocks from kings or Fox 

[hurbie]

17 minutes ago, uninformed said:

Going by the physical size alone it’s not going to be cheap. Have a look at the price of the bigger dia shocks from kings or Fox 

mmm have a look at HGV trailer shocks , really big , and not that expensive ..... i gues it's more to do with the market these 4x4 shocks go to ....

 

https://www.truckentrailerparts.nl/producten/artikelenbestand/bpw-artikelen/-22016-schokbreker-bpw/

Edited July 8, 2023 by hurbie

[uninformed]

20 minutes ago, hurbie said:

mmm have a look at HGV trailer shocks , really big , and not that expensive ..... i gues it's more to do with the market these 4x4 shocks go to ....

 

https://www.truckentrailerparts.nl/producten/artikelenbestand/bpw-artikelen/-22016-schokbreker-bpw/

65mm body is still smaller than the Boge, and what’s the rod dia?  but besides that they are mass produced and more simple than a Load Leveller. 
 

 

[deep]

It might seem a fair bit of money to get that unit rebuilt but it is money well spent.  I've had them on a few vehicles and they do make life so much nicer than the bone-jarring alternatives (unless you always travel at around the same weight and get springs to suit, of course).  I'm such a fan, in fact, that I still have a good spare in the shed, even though I don't currently have a coil sprung proper Land Rover!

I do have to caution against ANY attempt to repair one though.  They run something like 3,000 p.s.i. inside.  While a failed unit clearly won't have that pressure, you won't know if it still has a fairly deadly amount of pressure waiting inside to inflict grievous damage to your body.  Definitely one for the experts.

They do last well and a second hand one could well be just fine.  They were standard on Range Rovers for years, so there are still likely to be plenty around.  In this case, if you have a spare already, eat some concrete and get it fitted.  Great chance it will work and save you all the hassle of mucking around with lesser solutions later.

[reb78]

Just a note - i am pretty sure RRC and 110 versions are different sizes so dont get one to fit to the other. 

[Snagger]

On 7/8/2023 at 2:29 AM, FridgeFreezer said:

Makes me wonder if one of the aftermarket bling shock companies could build up a shock as a self-leveller, seems they share a lot of basic parts just perhaps assembled in slightly different order.

I’m not sure it’d work all that well in practice.  You might be able to get the comparatively supple suspension when light, the dampers only giving lift when the suspension sags enough, but with one on each side, you’d get the same stiffening of the cross-axle articulation as HD springs give, rather than the weight lift of the central Boge but no additional restriction that the LR original configuration gives.  If you have a later RRC with anti roll bars, then I suppose the point is moot, but for one without antiroll bars, I think you’d find them limiting cross axles far more.

[reb78]

Why would a shock absorber work at all? The Boge strut is like a pump with a preset height. A shock just damps the spring motion doesnt it, rather than maintaining height - the springs do that in combination with a shock absorber. I can see how an air strut might work but might also need some kind of damping function at one end?

Edited July 9, 2023 by reb78

[Bowie69]

Yup, totally different function. 

[FridgeFreezer]

Im aware it's a totally different function - but the construction shares a LOT in common with rebuildable gas shocks commonly seen on challenge trucks - and it *may* be possible to arrange / modify the internals in such a way to give the same behaviour.

Pretty sure compared to some of the KoH or Baja trucks, boosting the rear end of a 110 or RRC would be very light duty for a lot of them.

[Sigi_H]

23 hours ago, deep said:

I do have to caution against ANY attempt to repair one though.  They run something like 3,000 p.s.i. inside.  While a failed unit clearly won't have that pressure, you won't know if it still has a fairly deadly amount of pressure waiting inside to inflict grievous damage to your body.  Definitely one for the experts.

I second that. You definitly have to know, what you are doing.

[deep]

23 hours ago, reb78 said:

Just a note - i am pretty sure RRC and 110 versions are different sizes so dont get one to fit to the other. 

Interesting.   I had both at the same time and there was nothing obviously different, certainly not enough to make me want to directly compare them side by side.  Opportunity lost!