D90 Springs and Shocks

[Snagger]

They type for RRC and Discovery rear springs fit all four springs of D90, RRC and Discovery.  The D2 type might fit the front of a D90, but if the bolt pattern or spring diameter differs, they won’t, so it might be simpler just to use the type that definitely fit.  They don’t need to be bolted in, after all.

[landroversforever]

The trouble with the spring isolators is if you've got any kind of dislocation and/or retained springs then they'll be no good for anything other than a short spacer. 

Take the planned rear..... if you're putting them above the spring.... but then using axle side relocation, you have to bolt the spring to the top seat. Surely that's just going to transmit any of the noise you'd want to isolate. Similar with the front... if you've got the GL challenge spring retainers on the bottom, the isolators won't fit there. If you then have Gwyn's challenge shock turrets to suit the +5.5" they have an inbuilt cone, but not sure how the isolators would work where the tension comes off.

[steve b]

Dual rate springs can be spec'd for longer travel without dis-locating, maybe not challenge levels of travel but for road going and off road it's probably plenty. Not forgetting the front and rear winches and possibly diff-locks...

The D2 isolator with studs for the front fits Defender/RRC/D1 . The isolator is quite thick - 20mm ish.

Steve

[Troll Hunter]

I’m not wishing to hijack this thread, but I’ve not come across isolators mentioned in the Defender sub-forum previously.  From the above it appears that they can be fitted to standard Defenders, but are they effective in reducing noise transmitted into the cabin?

Mike

[steve b]

Yes , most definitely, a cheap and worthwhile upgrade.

Steve  

[Anderzander]

Here are the ones you can use front and rear. They aren’t expensive.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/275626771877?

Here are the other type for the front:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/301893005782?

[Anderzander]

Even cheaper pair :

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314371118399?

[muzaz]

13 hours ago, landroversforever said:

The trouble with the spring isolators is if you've got any kind of dislocation and/or retained springs then they'll be no good for anything other than a short spacer. 

Take the planned rear..... if you're putting them above the spring.... but then using axle side relocation, you have to bolt the spring to the top seat. Surely that's just going to transmit any of the noise you'd want to isolate. Similar with the front... if you've got the GL challenge spring retainers on the bottom, the isolators won't fit there. If you then have Gwyn's challenge shock turrets to suit the +5.5" they have an inbuilt cone, but not sure how the isolators would work where the tension comes off.

 Good point there, not sure how that could work. 

Quoting from Gwen Lewis website:

Quote

• If you have long travel dislocating suspension you have to be careful where you fit them.

So probably you could possibly fit them but it's up to you how, as most probably you'll loose them!

Then there is the issue of further lifting the truck if it has a lift kit which may cause other problems. GL has a different type isolator, a sort of a shrink sleeve. Will see when I get to that bridge.

Lucky they're cheap...

9 hours ago, Anderzander said:

Even cheaper pair :

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314371118399?

And even cheaper:

https://www.island-4x4.co.uk/spring-isolator-rubber-anr2938-p-4889.html

[Snagger]

16 hours ago, Troll Hunter said:

I’m not wishing to hijack this thread, but I’ve not come across isolators mentioned in the Defender sub-forum previously.  From the above it appears that they can be fitted to standard Defenders, but are they effective in reducing noise transmitted into the cabin?

Mike

Yes, they do make quite a difference.  They don’t fit the rear end of 110s or 130s, but do fit everywhere else of 90/110/130/RRC and Discovery I.  They are about 10mm thick.  The Discovery II front type bolt in, but appear substantially thicker - I did read they are 20mm somewhere.

16 hours ago, Troll Hunter said:

[Retroanaconda]

Had them fitted to my 90 for years. Didn’t fit them when I rebuilt it, and have never noticed any difference whatsoever.

I think we’re kidding ourselves if we think that a 10mm bit of rubber-coated steel is going to really have much effect. But they can’t do any harm I suppose. 

[Chicken Drumstick]

13 minutes ago, Retroanaconda said:

Had them fitted to my 90 for years. Didn’t fit them when I rebuilt it, and have never noticed any difference whatsoever.

I think we’re kidding ourselves if we think that a 10mm bit of rubber-coated steel is going to really have much effect. But they can’t do any harm I suppose. 

I would agree. I suspect you'd need a very quiet vehicle to notice them. On the RRC & D1 these are part of a lot of NVH changes, as well as a body tub mounted in a completely different way. Collectively all these changes have quite a big impact. But as a singular item I'm willing to bet most people would not be able to tell the difference.

[Anderzander]

51 minutes ago, Chicken Drumstick said:

Collectively …..

and that’s the point of any of these things to improve ride or reduce road noise isn’t it really. 😊👍🏻

 

Oh and I think James is turning into Mo 😆

[Troll Hunter]

23 hours ago, Troll Hunter said:

I’m not wishing to hijack this thread, but I’ve not come across isolators mentioned in the Defender sub-forum previously.  From the above it appears that they can be fitted to standard Defenders, but are they effective in reducing noise transmitted into the cabin?

Mike

Many thanks for the contrasting opinions.🤔  I don’t think I’ll be investing, but I could change my mind!

Mike

[muzaz]

Got a reply from GL and a quote with all the parts I would need according to the information I gave them. So I gave them the same info I posted here; tyres 33," all the acessories to be installed on the truck, etc.

The suggested shocks are the OME 60018L for both front and rear. These are the med valved shocks.

As for springs, the front pair are OME2751 and rear pair OME2762.

I told them I was not after a 2 inch lift per se, but a lift which would not have the tyres rubbing and support the weight of the extra kit without sagging.

Quote

Old Man Emu springs do give a vehicle a suspension lift. However, as you said below you have a bit of extra weight on your vehicle so will bring the vehicle height down. We have chosen the springs that will give you the least lift. 

However I'm a bit concerned regarding the front springs. The standard 90 front springs should be NRC9446 and NRC9447, these are 15.19" and 14.80" tall with a 175lb/in spring rate.

The OME2571 are 15.35" tall with a 225lb/in spring rate. Close to the standard 90 rear springs.

My concern is if they will lift enough to clear the tyres and stiff enough to hold the extra weight.

[landroversforever]

4 minutes ago, muzaz said:

Got a reply from GL and a quote with all the parts I would need according to the information I gave them. So I gave them the same info I posted here; tyres 33," all the acessories to be installed on the truck, etc.

The suggested shocks are the OME 60018L for both front and rear. These are the med valved shocks.

As for springs, the front pair are OME2751 and rear pair OME2762.

I told them I was not after a 2 inch lift per se, but a lift which would not have the tyres rubbing and support the weight of the extra kit without sagging.

However I'm a bit concerned regarding the front springs. The standard 90 front springs should be NRC9446 and NRC9447, these are 15.19" and 14.80" tall with a 175lb/in spring rate.

The OME2571 are 15.35" tall with a 225lb/in spring rate. Close to the standard 90 rear springs.

My concern is if they will lift enough to clear the tyres and stiff enough to hold the extra weight.

Clearing the tyres shouldn't be an issue either way. I ran 255/85R16 on wolf wheels with standard height suspension all round. Shame you're not in the UK as I'm sure there would be someone nearby with springs you can try.

[Bowie69]

I'd suggest both a taller and MUCH stiffer spring should be fine in your truck (a 50lb increase will definitely be noticeable).

If you want to get a better idea of how they will make it sit, get your truck weighed, especially the front and rear axle weights.

[Anderzander]

I have those yellow yellow springs with 255/85/16 and have no rubbing - I do have a modified offset to keep them away from the radius arms - and just put them out flush with the arches.

[muzaz]

6 hours ago, Bowie69 said:

I'd suggest both a taller and MUCH stiffer spring should be fine in your truck (a 50lb increase will definitely be noticeable).

If you want to get a better idea of how they will make it sit, get your truck weighed, especially the front and rear axle weights.

Do you mean even taller and stiffer than the GL recommend springs? The std front NRC9447 (blu Yel) spring are 14.8" tall and 175lb/in. The OME2751  recommended by GL is 15.35" tall and 225lb/in. Half an inch taller and 50lb stiffer.

6 hours ago, landroversforever said:

Clearing the tyres shouldn't be an issue either way. I ran 255/85R16 on wolf wheels with standard height suspension all round. Shame you're not in the UK as I'm sure there would be someone nearby with springs you can try.

Ye clearing the tyres with the added weight is my concern, might try the rear springs at the front, and see how it looks like. Will look around for borrowing some springs, there are quite a few landies over here.

[Bowie69]

7 minutes ago, muzaz said:

Do you mean even taller and stiffer than the GL recommend springs? The std front NRC9447 (blu Yel) spring are 14.8" tall and 175lb/in. The OME2751  recommended by GL is 15.35" tall and 225lb/in. Half an inch taller and 50lb stiffer.

I mean what I wrote, you will definitely notice a 225lb spring that is also half an inch longer.

[landroversforever]

2 hours ago, muzaz said:

Do you mean even taller and stiffer than the GL recommend springs? The std front NRC9447 (blu Yel) spring are 14.8" tall and 175lb/in. The OME2751  recommended by GL is 15.35" tall and 225lb/in. Half an inch taller and 50lb stiffer.

Ye clearing the tyres with the added weight is my concern, might try the rear springs at the front, and see how it looks like. Will look around for borrowing some springs, there are quite a few landies over here.

Worst case for clearing will always be when it’s articulating, and they were always fine then other than a little rubbing on the underside of the tub wheelboxes.

Just checking the red90 spring list, http://red90.ca/rovers/springinfo.html

mine were yellow/white on the front which are 225lb/in and 14.8” long. And the red/blue on the rear which are the same poundage but 15.3”. Both of which are 90 rear springs or d110/130 HD option. Really not much difference in the way it sits front and rear…. The slop of the road makes it look much more. 

[muzaz]

25 minutes ago, landroversforever said:

mine were yellow/white on the front which are 225lb/in and 14.8” long. And the red/blue on the rear which are the same poundage but 15.3”. Both of which are 90 rear springs or d110/130 HD option

Do you have added weight at the front, can't see clearly from the photo. But it looks quite balanced and level. Your truck looks similar to what I have in mind so the set up suggested by GL is close when you factor in a rear winch and tray and a front bumper.

[landroversforever]

39 minutes ago, muzaz said:

Do you have added weight at the front, can't see clearly from the photo. But it looks quite balanced and level. Your truck looks similar to what I have in mind so the set up suggested by GL is close when you factor in a rear winch and tray and a front bumper.

At the time of the picture the front goldfish wasn’t in place.

The rear had a pile of recovery gear with strops, shackles etc. but also a Southdown removable tow pack/tank guard which isn’t a light lump. Spare tyre is in the back along with ARB compressor etc. Previous owner had this setup with a milemarker on the front, hydro tank in the back, waffle boards etc. 

[Stellaghost]

Somebody mention articulation.....

.......lol

regards Stephen 

[muzaz]

1 hour ago, landroversforever said:

At the time of the picture the front goldfish wasn’t in place.

The rear had a pile of recovery gear with strops, shackles etc. but also a Southdown removable tow pack/tank guard which isn’t a light lump. Spare tyre is in the back along with ARB compressor etc. Previous owner had this setup with a milemarker on the front, hydro tank in the back, waffle boards etc. 

Alright then, I should be fine. Better start saving now, I asked for a qoute for the complete set up with bushes, cranked arms, A-frame joint, shocks, springs etc... WoW!!!     More than 2k      I'll have to short list to the necessary only for now. Shipping cost is a killer when things get heavy 😢 

@Stellaghost Impressive!  If I get half of that I would be happy!

[Troll Hunter]

28 minutes ago, muzaz said:

Shipping cost is a killer when things get heavy 😢 

When I worked in Kuwait, where I bought my 110, I bought a whole pile of bits that were quite heavy, probably about 100kg, and had them shipped out on a pallet by sea.  It was reasonably cheap as I remember.  This might be an option if you are not in a hurry.

Mike