miketomcat Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 I'm not a fan of the grenadier it's not close enought or far enough away from the defender for me. However this https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/ineos/362396/new-ineos-fusilier-electric-4x4-charges-grenadiers-smaller-and-greener-sibling Is close enough to the G wagon for me to like it. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyoldgit Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreePointFive Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 What's the mpg? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy996 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 22 minutes ago, ThreePointFive said: What's the mpg? Not a clue, very little information is out yet. this is about the sum total of the published information, https://ineosgrenadier.com/en/gb/news/introducing-the-ineos-fusilier. It will be another Magna developed vehicle available as a BEV and a BEV with a REX, (ICE range extender). The rumour-mill suggests it will be lower, shorter, heavier and more expensive than the Grenadier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 Radcliffe’s comments about European (including UK) policy forcing manufacturers and buyers alike into a soley BEV future were interesting.  It seems he hold a view similar to Toyota, which is a far smarter and more balanced view than the idiots making policy. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 16 hours ago, jeremy996 said: The rumour-mill suggests it will be lower, shorter, heavier and more expensive than the Grenadier. It may end up getting a lot of tax breaks in some countries though .. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 On 2/24/2024 at 5:28 AM, ThreePointFive said: What's the mpg? Obviously, the full battery version works in a different language! However, the one with the petrol motor could be interesting.  A good friend's sister had a Nissan car with that system - a small  petrol motor solely charging the battery and drive being only electric.  Apparently, the motor turns on fairly regularly and revs its little heart out for a while, until the battery has enough charge, then turns completely off.  It's a sensible system, because the charging motor only runs at peak efficiency and the electric drive loses little energy.  I can't remember what he said the miles per gallon were but I remember it was outstanding.  A bigger, heavier Fusilier with more wind resistance won't be outstanding but I'll bet it's well above 30 miles per gallon in general use. I'm definitely keen to see how that pans out.  I'm also encouraged by the comment that their hydrogen vehicle would be ready now, if there was a refuelling network available... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 17 hours ago, deep said: Obviously, the full battery version works in a different language! However, the one with the petrol motor could be interesting.  A good friend's sister had a Nissan car with that system - a small  petrol motor solely charging the battery and drive being only electric.  Apparently, the motor turns on fairly regularly and revs its little heart out for a while, until the battery has enough charge, then turns completely off.  It's a sensible system, because the charging motor only runs at peak efficiency and the electric drive loses little energy.  I can't remember what he said the miles per gallon were but I remember it was outstanding.  A bigger, heavier Fusilier with more wind resistance won't be outstanding but I'll bet it's well above 30 miles per gallon in general use. I'm definitely keen to see how that pans out.  I'm also encouraged by the comment that their hydrogen vehicle would be ready now, if there was a refuelling network available... That is my understanding, and it does make engineering, thermodynamic and straight common sense.  Should be better in most respects than a typical hybrid and none of the range worries of a full BEV.  I’m still concerned about the safety of lithium ion batteries, though, regardless of their size. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy996 Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 I've signed up for the updates as they come, so I'll add them here. I really don't see me buying a Fusilier when they are released; my Grenadier will only be 3-4 years old and I intend to run it to expiry, (mine or its!) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 Looking at the pictures provided and reading between the lines, does this look more like a Freelander2 type vehicle than a smaller Grenadier? Â Narrower, lower, smaller wheels, possibly independent suspension and possibly a monocoque? Â Or am I way off the mark? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 I had a look at a video last night that analysed the Fusilier based on the scant information currently available. Â The bloke agreed it was likely indespension and low, so I might be on the mark after all. Â Sadly, but understandably, Ineos is already branching into the mainstream... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 Looks like a 5 door Jimny 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreePointFive Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 On 2/23/2024 at 4:56 PM, jeremy996 said: Not a clue, very little information is out yet. this is about the sum total of the published information, https://ineosgrenadier.com/en/gb/news/introducing-the-ineos-fusilier. It will be another Magna developed vehicle available as a BEV and a BEV with a REX, (ICE range extender). The rumour-mill suggests it will be lower, shorter, heavier and more expensive than the Grenadier. Sorry Jeremy, my poor attempt at humour. Interesting stuff that they're pursuing this though, not sure if it's a departure from their mission statement or a way to broaden the business to make the core product (Grenadier) more viable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 On 3/28/2024 at 2:10 PM, ThreePointFive said: Sorry Jeremy, my poor attempt at humour. Interesting stuff that they're pursuing this though, not sure if it's a departure from their mission statement or a way to broaden the business to make the core product (Grenadier) more viable. It’ll be how they meet the UK/EU regulations on selling a proportion of EVs and avoid those heavy fines on selling too many ICE cars.  It isn’t a measure of Ratcliffe or Ineos’ faith in BEVs. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy996 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 It look like the Fusilier is likely to be in for an early bath;Â https://www.kleinezeitung.at/wirtschaft/18625680/keine-fertigung-bei-magna-ineos-zieht-in-graz-den-stecker For those like me who gave up German at O Level, Google Translate comes up with this:- Â "Ineos unplugs in Graz: But no car production at Magna Next shock for Magna Steyr: The young British car brand Ineos stops the development of the planned electric off-road vehicle in Graz and also cancels the production of the fuselier. The Ineos production of up to 30,000 pieces per year would have secured 2000 jobs. The momentous Fisker disaster is followed by the next bad news for Magna Steyr: The British start-up Ineos Automotive is withdrawing from Graz with immediate effect. Lynn Calder, the CEO of the car division, personally delivered the bad news and informed the Magna top in Graz about the group's decision. According to this, Ineos in Graz not only stops the development of the electric off-road vehicle, but also cancels the production of the third model series, which should have run off the production line at Magna from 2027. Almost 300 employees have been employed in the development in Graz for two years, who now have to worry about their job. The production of up to 30,000 pieces per year would have secured 2000 jobs. Roland Prettner, head of Magna Steyr, confirms the stop to the Kleine Zeitung on request: "We are informed by Ineos about their decision, respect it and discuss the necessary next steps with the customer." Magna Steyr is now "actively working with existing and potential new customers on several projects". Prettner: "As one of the largest contract manufacturers, we trust in our skills and experience and are optimistic about winning further projects." Doubtful profitability The decisive factor for the withdrawal was the business case, the forecasts and dubious profitability had recently spoken against the construction of the electric Ineo. The slump in the electric car market has influenced the decision. The fusilier, intended as an entry-level model of Ineos and presented only a few weeks ago in London, is being put on hold for the time being. This is why owner Jim Ratcliffe has by no means questioned Ineos' car plans. The British billionaire has ordered to focus on the global sales of the two models Grenadier and Quartermaster for the time being in order to consolidate the brand on the market and make it visible. The focus is on the USA, and the sale is also to take place in China soon. Both vehicles are built in the former smart plant in Hambach, France. Search for alternatives The terrain giant Grenadier, with which Ineos started in 2022, has already been developed for series production at Magna in Graz. This year, Ineos wants to build at least 25,000 vehicles. What it will cost Ineos to get out of the various contracts is not yet clear. Magna now places hopes on Chinese car manufacturers, among other things, some negotiations for development and production should be promising. And as you can hear, the Chinese (Chery, Geely) are also supposed to be interested in joining Magna." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 Seemingly the only people still convinced by the EV utopia are western politicians. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 12 hours ago, jeremy996 said: The slump in the electric car market has influenced the decision. There has been a lot of enthusiasm for a mode of transport that doesn't really do what it's supposed to do (electric cars still use masses of resources and energy and lead to environmental problems, just not directly in the fake world of big cities), isn't cheap and is only practical in select use cases. Â I'm still a little surprised, because the Fusilier was a bit of a niche product that I'd have thought would have had significant appeal. Â I think this is the first time I've been sad an electric car project has been canned! Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy996 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 9 hours ago, Snagger said: Seemingly the only people still convinced by the EV utopia are western politicians. In energy terms EVs make a lot of sense, so in the future if personal transport still exists in 100 years, it will probably be electric. The Fusilier was a niche within a niche and I struggled to see the point other than as a "compliance car". My wife's next car will probably be an EV as her travel envelope is 40 miles a day. Whether it is a new car or an EV module into her existing Fiat 500C depends on the costs at the time. There is no chance she will spend the £30k of a new EV Fiat 500C, so either the cost comes down by a third or she'll buy a used something. (There is a drop-in kit for a Maxda MX5 NB, but the cost is still too high). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 A shame it is dropped, but understandable. The whole EV argument can only work if the electricity comes from renewables and the battery last the life of the car and also it has to be financially viable for people to adopt them. Neither of these are currently the case, but when it happens they will become main stream At the moment, If I was looking for an EV, I would look at a used one, as their depreciation is eye-watering! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 Reading more elsewhere, the decision was based in part on the range-extender version, which was a small battery, small turbo petrol engine to charge the battery -legislation was unclear meaning that there may have been no way to sell it in the EU. If unable to make both EV and RE version it wasn't worth it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 Double shame then, as the range extender concept truly is efficient, if a little bizarre in use (charging engine comes on and runs at fairly high revs, not when you need extra power but after the battery is a bit depleted). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.