Hybrid_From_Hell Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 Hi All, Due to the 90 Being 'Truck Cabed' I have been playing with spring poundages again, happy now with what I have - with one small issue. That issue is that on a 90 the springs on the front are handed, what I have now is 2 x springs the same length, so it has 'a lean' on the drivers side - and thats before Mr Porky gets in So, for a temp measure I machined the biggest spacer I could (about 10mm) and added a anti rattle shim under the spring - another 8mm and that gave me around 18-20mm "Lift" - not enough, need more and I can't get more this way as the shock pin isn't long enough So, here is 'Plan B' so far. Take a spring seat, machine out the centre, then a piece of tube cut and lathed up to give a lift, and then (to do) make up a mounting plate for the base to be able to then bolt to the axle and then bolt the shock through etc etc I can make sure by machining off excess that I end up with the hight I want without all the pin / shock probs So far so good, ..........now where I am open to ideas I need to bolt my spring down on the base as they do dislocate , and I am as yet still uncertain how best to do this, on most suspensions a flat C shaped plate goes across and around the shock, but now these bolts are 1" + away So, ideas please - how can I simply bolt the seat to this new made assemble ? I have toyed with various ideas, even as daft as jubilee clipping around the spring and through slots in the tube, so I thought I'd post up here and see what ideas may pop out Fire away Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR90 Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 As often Gwyn has a novel and good approach (though it doesn't quite work for you). The spring only needs retaining on the inside and if it is not being retained at the top is under little tension at full droop. Id look at adding one slot to the new 'seat' and undo and pass a jubilee clip through it and then fasten. Make sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted June 12, 2009 Author Share Posted June 12, 2009 As often Gwyn has a novel and good approach (though it doesn't quite work for you).The spring only needs retaining on the inside and if it is not being retained at the top is under little tension at full droop. Id look at adding one slot to the new 'seat' and undo and pass a jubilee clip through it and then fasten. Make sense? Hmmm Hadn't considered that Was just mulling over an idea of welding a block of steel say 3/4ins x3/4 ins on the inside, oxy acet-ing a plate curved spring wise, bolting through the side into the block and then tightening down with the 2nd bolt - but with your idea wouldn't need to be tight if just one side clamped Will be interested with how this thread progresses - 1 post and 1 great help already Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishbosh Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 Erm, Gwyn makes a 1" spacer....... HERE and spring retainer HERE Would seem to fit your bill....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJIbex Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 Jubilee clip's will snap with repeated articulation, it's what I tried before using dislocation cones on the 90. Need another plan! That was really helpful, sorry. Mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted June 12, 2009 Author Share Posted June 12, 2009 Erm, Gwyn makes a 1" spacer....... HEREand spring retainer HERE Would seem to fit your bill....... Erm...... Thanks Bish, but its either 'one' or the 'other' re your post not 'both', as the 2x bolts are below the spring base Hence the prob I'm In Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJIbex Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 Your still running with the front dampers running through the middle of the spring? So the spring can't completely mislocate on the way back down as with the rears or on a damper relocated set up. So I presume the concern is with the spring potentialy damaging the shock? If that is it wouldn't a small inwards taper to/ontop your design, leaving room for some shock movement, cure the issue. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted June 12, 2009 Author Share Posted June 12, 2009 Yep I have some cones on the top (bolted to the turret to guide back on and Shocks +5 through the centres. Somehow I need to lock the bottom of the spring to the new unit, I'll have a thinky as I go to sleep I like Trevs idea of only 1 side needed, and I'm guessing now that the "Fix" needs to be "Strong" (ie stronger than a jubilee clip) but not "Solid" which is is at the mo with a plate right across and around the shock Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 bit of 5mm plate bent into a sort of P shape but the ring only steps over the spring coil and then hookes under the spring seat where the coil sits on top and then has a bolt going horizontly into the bit of tube you welded on. It all makes oerfect sense in my head but i've just got in from the pub so it may well be absolute cack . oh yh it only fixs one side so springy can still discolate a little. Will. Edit: this sort of thing, plus it has lots of nice bends and stuff which i'm sure should give you plenty of oppurtunity to F up and write us a humerous post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoor Ed Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 As usual Muddy you have some great ideas. usually when you are slightly drunk! I love the diagram by the way. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 How about welding some tabs to the inside of the spring seat plate and use rivnuts to secure a spring retainer bar (similar to what you did before)? Obviously you'd need to locate the tabs carefully so you've still got access to the spring seat mounting bolts and you'd also have to think about making sure they don't catch on the shock body. If the latter is a problem then how about having the tabs on the seat outside the spring and then running a retainer bar all the way across the spring and out either side? Not a very elegant solution, though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Could you not use a Range Rover isolator ring at the top of the spring on that side? would that give the lift you need? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOR4x4 Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Will that not do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 That's just a spring seat - his issue is that he is using raised spring seats, like those in the front of your pic, to give a little extra height - but he then can't find a good solution for how to retain the spring onto that plate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishbosh Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Erm......Thanks Bish, but its either 'one' or the 'other' re your post not 'both', as the 2x bolts are below the spring base Hence the prob I'm In Nige Not true, the retainer clips over the spring seat and is held down by the bolts. All you need is some longer bolts, preferably threaded over their full length. If you sandwich the retainer plate between the head of the bolt and a nut and use a second and third nut to bolt the spacer to the axle bracket you should be good to go. By the power of Paint: Now I know you wont get cap headed 12.9 bolts fully threaded, but for this application my detailed analysis shows that you can get away with a bit of threadbar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 a tube between the inner upper & lower nuts would help the longer bolt resist any bending along it's length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 But might there be clearance issues with the shock doing it this way??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted June 13, 2009 Author Share Posted June 13, 2009 ^^^ Yep - spot on Mr W - just come in to print off the Zeus book as I can't find mine and did the waggle the shock about and yep it would foul. I have a poss solution, based on the fact as Trev mentioned held vs clamped solid would do Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
errol209 Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Do you think the spring might rotate in use? If not, why not add a lip to the spring seat so that it retains the toe of the bottom turn of the spring? The spring would "wind on", securing it (perhaps a better system at the top to stop it rotating?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewy1984 Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 sorry if anyones already said this, havnt read all the posts. extend the normal retaining bracket horse shoe round the damper ones, so they sticks outside of the springs, then weld tabs onto the spring seat. and bolt together? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted June 13, 2009 Author Share Posted June 13, 2009 Right, Well with a combo of Muddys thoughts (even if drunk ) and LR90s I have had a go and done this : Made new base and drilled holes, tack welded it on trail fitted and measurements taken, then based removed, reduced to required height (was too high) and then weld up ...and lathed it off afterwards so base flush and level to axle mounting : Then the fixing the spring, rather than clamp the thing solid a la original, I have gone with LR90s idea re clamped gently but only on the inside, used a lump of 3/4 ins solid bar drilled and tapped M8 x 2 and then some 5mm plate shaped heated with Oxy Acet and beaten about a la Muddys idea and then all fitted and clamped up - dropped axle and it seems to be OK Thanks for the idea all, better result as a result of my asking, maybe this may help others get there finished spring heights tweaked, rears are so simple with no shocker through them, just add lump of spacer plate Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boothy Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Why didn't you just swap the springs around left for right ???, its a lot quicker Essex lad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted June 13, 2009 Author Share Posted June 13, 2009 But there the same length Guv Did you mean fit them upside down and wrong way round ?? Oh, And its 'Sussex Sunny' Not 'Essex Lad' - anyway, haven't you got a ferret to groom molest ? Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Tut tut mr nige, did you not see my engineering drawing?? the clamp must be far more wiggly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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