Simon Smith Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 A warning to all those who drive vehicles with electronic handbrakes. We just had a new shape VW beetle crash into the front of the shop, moving the whole shop front in by 2". It was parked on our steep drive with the handbrake on when it suddenly released. The lever was still applied. A quick search on the internet revealed this to be a very common problem with all current VW cars. It also affects some other makes such as Lexus. I don't know if any LR products have reported this issue, but if you have an electronic handbrake, please park in gear or in Park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cieranc Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 VW's also suffer with the brake not releasing, a common problem. Solution we find is to disconnect the battery and hold the leads together for a minute (to dissipate power in the modules), then reconnect. This should reset the park brake module. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave88sw Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 whats wrong with a bloody cable, tried and tested and FFS it WORKS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cieranc Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 Ugggh, that unsightly lever, which requires an actual physical input to operate???? How very common. No, in time you'll learn to appreciate the class of an electric handbrake my friend Seems cables and levers are now considered too primitive for the snooty ones these days! They'd rather have a switch, control module, actuators, motors in the hubs. And pay top dollar to have the handbrake shoes replaced, as you need a scantool to wind the motors back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 I always thaught the construction and use regs stated the car REQUIRED handbrake cables? Many a rally car fitted with hydraulic handbrake has had to pikey something together to get it thru the MOT... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 I always thaught the construction and use regs stated the car REQUIRED handbrake cables?Many a rally car fitted with hydraulic handbrake has had to pikey something together to get it thru the MOT... I undrestand that the handbrake operating mechanism has to be mechanical....Like a truck has springs in the air system to put the brakes on. Ford found some time ago that the Mexico rally car wasn't legal with a hydraulic handbrake. That's why they had two handbrake systems. Perhaps somebody could explain how the electronc handbrake works. Or in this case doesn't work. mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 Wikipedia says this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_brake#Ne...c_parking_brake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 Well you pull a switch which tells an ECU to talk to another ECU and then decide whether or not to tell a relay to provide power to an actuator to pull a cable and engage the brake shoes. Or sometimes to go "screeeeeaaOOOOOWWWWdonkdonkdonkdonkdonkbongbongbong Handbrake Fault" Nice and simple Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 Well you pull a switch which tells an ECU to talk to another ECU and then decide whether or not to tell a relay to provide power to an actuator to pull a cable and engage the brake shoes.Or sometimes to go "screeeeeaaOOOOOWWWWdonkdonkdonkdonkdonkbongbongbong Handbrake Fault" Nice and simple your just beyond help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cieranc Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 It's an Audi A6 we had problems with. You have to use a scanner to tell the module to unwind the motors to back the brakes off. Absolutely un-necessary and completely over engineered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JST Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 Or sometimes to go "screeeeeaaOOOOOWWWWdonkdonkdonkdonkdonkbongbongbong Handbrake Fault" absolutely bang on with the sound there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pat_pending Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 This is what happens when you listen to "marketing" and let electronics geeks loose in the design dept'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 Wonder what they're like at handbrake turns, or does the ECU not allow it? I'm all for electronics but things always fail when marketing gets in the way and tries to be clever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJIbex Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 Wonder what they're like at handbrake turns, or does the ECU not allow it? I'm all for electronics but things always fail when marketing gets in the way and tries to be clever. The LR one's just preform a controlled pretty rapid stop. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 You might be able to do a handbrake turn on ice but that would be about all - as Mr Ibex says, if you hold the switch up with the handbrake moving it progessively applies the handbrake as an emergency stop in case of brake failure - makes a bloody awful noise but is quite effective (unless it is broken). The electric handbrake in the D3 is as silly as the push-in key on the new Freelander - why oh why reinvent something that has worked well for 50 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Smith Posted July 14, 2009 Author Share Posted July 14, 2009 I have been told that the VW handbook tells you to park in gear or "P". This seems to be an admission that the handbrake does not work, therefore how did they get it through type approval with a known fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 It is always recommended practice on anything as any mechanical item can break - including a cable. It is just that if you make something 8 times as complicated as it needs to be then it is correspondingly 8 times more likely to go wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 I always leave my Defender in gear, never trust that handbrake. Even when I eventually put an X-Brake on it I'll probably still park it in gear, better to be safe than sorry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Smith Posted July 14, 2009 Author Share Posted July 14, 2009 Always leave mine in gear even with the X brake. But I have never had a handbrake failure in my life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101sean Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 We had a new V8 auto D3 on loan at work a few years ago and I used it to ferry my boss and his cronies to Twickenham for a jolly. On the way home I was sat at lights in D, handbrake on and without thinking, decided to blip the throttle to listen to the lovely V8 burble, at which the handbrake automatically disengaged and almost catapulted me into the car in front Just managed to stop in time, gave me a bit of a scare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 It is just that if you make something 8 times as complicated as it needs to be then it is correspondingly 8 times more likely to go wrong I thought if you made it 8 times more complicated it was about 64 times more likely to go wrong (my maths is a bit shaky but I think that's fairly close). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cieranc Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 We had a new V8 auto D3 on loan at work a few years ago and I used it to ferry my boss and his cronies to Twickenham for a jolly. On the way home I was sat at lights in D, handbrake on and without thinking, decided to blip the throttle to listen to the lovely V8 burble, at which the handbrake automatically disengaged and almost catapulted me into the car in front Just managed to stop in time, gave me a bit of a scare Yep, been out to a D3 for Mondial. The owner had just taken delivery of it and was reporting that the handbrake wouldn't release. The salesman had told him that if he put it in drive and accelerated, the handbrake would release automatically. Which it wouldn't do. It worked fine if you just pushed/pulled the button. Engaged/disengaged just fine. But no, the guy decided he had to call me out at 10pm to investigate. And then insisted it be recovered to the dealers. Even though it drove fine and just needed the button to be pushed! Sometimes I have to bite my tongue! Something which has crossed my mind, regarding the secondary/emergency brake. What if the fault is that the battery negative becomes detatched whilst driving. Imagine the scene, you're doing 70 on the motorway, there's brake lights up ahead. The lead comes off. Engine cuts out, no servo assistance. The 2.5 ton machine is hard to stop with no servo asistance, and the car in front is becoming slightly more stationary than you are comfortable with. You go for the secondary brake. Does this work with no power? No. The car in front is now considerably more stationary than you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 tbh the foot brake even without servo is going to do more to stop the vehicle from 70 than a handbrake operating on the rear wheels, but i do see your point and i dislike the idea of the electronics in such a system. The lack of servo just means you need to press a LOT harder. Another point to note is that with even a normal mechanical handbrake, i'm sure 5 litres of V8 would easily overpower it and let the vehicle move, even with it fully engaged, so revving up an auto with it in D is a big nono regardless of the type handbrake! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101sean Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 so revving up an auto with it in D is a big nono regardless of the type handbrake! Realise that, just forgot it was an auto! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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