Huff Posted March 27, 2011 Share Posted March 27, 2011 Hi all. I PM'ed Fridgefreezer to ask him about his mods and he gave me a few pointers and suggested that I post here to see if anyone else has any ideas. I currently have a Series 3 88" that is the worse for wear (currently in bits around my garage) I am treating it to a new chassis from Richards and a rebuilt galv bulkhead. Basically I want to annoy the Honda VTEC owners at work by taking them at the lights. So I am looking to drop a V8 lump (4.6l sounds nice) connected to a R380 and LT230. The engine will be Megasquirted and LPG'ed. I understand that I need to modify the chassis to take this. I emailed Richards (telling them to hold my order while I get my head around what needs doing) to see if they can modify a chassis to suit this mod. They said they can send it off to someone to do the relevant mods but I will get an price at some point when the guy is back to work... Firstly has anyone had any dealings with doing this. e.g buying a chassis pre-modified? Also if I modify a chassis with different engine/gearbox mounts (or buy one pre-modified) will I incur the wrath of the DVLA for a non standard replacement chassis? (trying to keep the points below 8) As I will be putting stupid quantities of horses down to the ground I will also need to look at the axles. I am guessing the standard series axles just wont cut it. Is there any way to strengthen them up or should I look around for something better? I was thinking of putting disco/RR axles on but that involves a lot of cutting and welding to take the leaf spring mounts. Is there any other suggestions? Preferably something that can bolt on with relative ease. (if it needs chopping and modifying, it is probably more worthwhile to do that to other landrover based axles.) Why am I defiling an innocent series 3 and why shouldn't I just buy a Defender?? I happen to like series land rovers. And I like the idea of making something that looks agricultural and should be on a farm to go like a stink! :-) Anyway guys, Thanks in advance! Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Woodward Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 I'll think you'll find that the length of the engine and transmission will be too long to fit a 88" keeping the Series front and a usable rear prop. If you're bothered about the points it wont add up will it? Different transmission, engine and axles. If it's not tax exempt I wouldnt worry about it personally. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 If it's the look you want I'd possibly look at putting a Series 88" body onto a 90 chassis, would be less work than fitting coiler axles to the 88" chassis and makes it easier to fit PAS etc. You'd retain the 90's reg as the chassis, suspension and steering would all be retained, and possibly the axles if you choose to upgrade what's there. Only engine and transmission (and maybe axles) would be swapped, so you'd be within the points allowance. The body makes no odds to the ID so you can do as you like, I'd suggest a Defender bulkhead/dash with Series front end and rear tub/doors etc. You'd need to lengthen an 88" roof or shorten a 109" roof (the latter is probably easier), in order to fit the Series screen. You'll also need to weld on some hinges to the bulkhead, but they're easy enough to cut off a scrap Series bulkhead Coiler axles can be upgraded easier to handle the extra power too (although it's not impossible with leafer axles). I would say that a large amount of power is better put through coil suspension than leaves due to less potential for axle wrap etc. by design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon White Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 V8 will fit onto standard 2.25 mounts if you buy the correct conversion kit. You wil need to use a conversion ring and a 4pot bellhousing as the V8 one will be too long in an 88". If you're running an R380 you'll need to run the ultra-rare short bellhousing. If you run an LT77 a standard 4 pot bellhousing will do. The only chassis mods you will need are to delete the gearbox mount cross member, get the chassis drilled and tubed for the LT230 gearbox mounts, and you'll need to scallop the bellhousing crossmember to clear the propshaft. You'll need to run a disk handbrake as theres not enough clearance to get the drum on and off cos the centre crossmember is in the way otherwise. If you run a defender box then the gear levers come out in a senseable place. Make the tunnel and floor pans up to suit. Your problem will be with the handling and axles. Spring wrap is a real problem with these, and to date I've not seen an anti-wrap setup for the front axle that actually seems to work. Uprated components for series axles are more or less unobtainable these days. There is a company in the states that does them but they wont ship overseas and they're silly, silly money. You could fit coiler axles, and uprate them. in order to stand a chance of winning the traffic light grand prix, you're probably going to need at least 300bhp, if not more, and I suspect you'll struggle to keep it cool within the confines of the series front end. IMHO a series is too heavy to turn into a go -faster machine - you'd be better off with a V8 powered kit car by the sounds of things! Jon have to say however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazzar Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 I'm just thinking, If you want to win at the traffic lights, would a diesel not suit you better? The torque of a diesel is ideal for this, though, of course the petrol car will win once you hit 20 mph. Remember the old adage: Horsepower sells cars, torque wins races! Also, if you fit new halfshafts throughout then they should be ok for a year or so - it's the constant flexing of them that work hardens them, leading to stress failure. And if you fit a LSD such as a truetrac then the diff weakpoint is eliminated, especially if you fit the tougher crown and pinions from a coiler. Permanent 4wd would spread the torque out better, too. Though, seriously, if I wanted to do this I'd build a Mr Bean style mini with a honda VTEC, or Opel/Vauxhall 16 valve powerplant. Oh, and wear a hat. G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobotMan Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Lt95 with 101 short bellhousing. Avoid parabolics use standard multileaf springs. Get a parachute to deploy for braking! Build yours standard, sell it. Buy a v8 80" trialer and put it on the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
task Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Is the sole purpose of this machine going to be winning at the lights? If so then perhaps you can afford to think a little outside the box... 1. Fit a car auto box, 2wd. 2. Uprate the back axle and fit some grippy rubber 3. Reduce weight. You've already lost the TX box. Smaller "fuel cell" type tank, rag-top, strip the back out completely (no seats/carpets/sound proofing). Lighter wheels (alloys). 4. Small wheels to keep the gearing down Of course you're still going to need to uprate the brakes but if you're 2WD then it makes the front axle a little easier to do. This will make it fairly quick but very neutered for anything other than dragging off the lights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 To modify Tasks's reply slightly: Fit a V8 & 4-speed auto & LT230, uprate the axles, and then race off the lights in low-box. You'll beat absolutely anything to ~30mph. You can create quite a lot of space in a Series engine bay by trimming the back of the radiator panel down flat and mounting the rad right on the back with a leccy fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 I've always had a soft spot for this: My link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tacr2man Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 a series 88 with a lot of power is only for drag racing , as they are very twitchy due the short wheelbase and height , if you get tempted to use the power in other situations . as mentioned cooling can be a bit marginal as well if you stay with the series front , nice to have the power for towing , and off road response which is what I built mine for many years back . Why not drop your V8 in a morris minor if surprise is what you want ? JMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 cooling can be a bit marginal as well if you stay with the series front Just to clarify - ...only if you keep the Series rad. My Series (6cyl) rad cooled the 3.9EFI well enough, and the 4.6 that's now in there is overcooled with custom rad + series front panel, just minus all the cowling behind the panel. I've only had the fans come on fast when doing donuts in low box for prolonged periods . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
task Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 My 3.9 is cooled by the standard rad + kenlowe fan, it doesn't get treated lightly either Buy my SWB, fit a supercharger and a NOS kit, axles + gbox should last long enough to upset your workmates at least once! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 I love the whole wolf in sheep's clothing idea, but it will take a lot to beat a VTEC at the lights. When I had my 88" with 3.5 I could always count on beating a worn out XR3i or similar, without having to go too silly with the welly pedal, but modern day chav mobiles are a bit quicker than that. Of course there's always the one muppet that will sit at the lights revving his engine, and when the lights change he has a) forgotten to put in in gear, or b) got the wrong gear and you just leave him in your mirror, endless amusement As for strengthened drive lines, a mate of mine used some Jag rear axle bits to cobble something up for a Chevy powered LR once. Didn't manage to break while in his possession. Don't forget you'll still need to stop for the next set of lights Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 Pictures is broken but Rogue Trooper is well ahead here: http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=21281 Mickey - I've yet to see a chav who knows how to drive, they mostly know how to make a lot of noise, or maybe do donuts in McD's car park. Also they've usually got 4 mates in the back eating chips, which slows the average Saxo down a tad. I had one off the lights in my RRC towing a car trailer once Bear in mind that things have progressed elsewhere too - an old carbed 3.5 is knocking on for ~40% down on a healthy EFI lump especially if Megasquirt & EDIS are in the equation, it really does make things much more lively and driveable. MS also has a NOS controller built in of course Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 I had one off the lights in my RRC towing a car trailer once I did something similar: 4.6 RRC with a boat on the back, and a roof full of windsurfing kit VS a chavved up Clio (I think) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the real muddy90 Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 I love this idea My first car was a s2a which I put a rover p6 v8 (180ish bhp) into, but I went to ashcroft who used to do a lot of auto & gearbox conversions at the time. So I used an lt77 out of an sd1 with the short stick with ashcroft conversion to the s2a trans box with high ratio gears. The thing was scary fast (100mph)& trafic light gp's were a hoot It was scruffy with most of the ali showing through the paint. I think your problem if you want to be fast will be getting a fast gear change. A 380 or 77 has too long a throw to do propper quick shifts & you'll soon be left for dust. My short stick was really quick & slick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToyRoverlander Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 I think your problem if you want to be fast will be getting a fast gear change. A 380 or 77 has too long a throw to do propper quick shifts & you'll soon be left for dust. My short stick was really quick & slick. An auto will solve this, plus it will be way kinder on the rest of the driveline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicks90 Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 get rid of the 4wd and stick with rear wheel drive - buy an old jag and use the nice straight 6 with auto to power a rear salisbury axle from an early 110 - should hold together nicely. Also gives you much more room for manouver with regards gear levers - as the auto shifter can be moved about a bit and not as heavily dependant on positioning as the manual is. There are plenty of old rusty jags ready for the taking and power is well over 200bhp for the 3.2 and 4.0 versions and the AJ6 engine is moderately simple, i think it uses a simillar hotwire system that the rover v8 uses you could even go old school and try find an old XJ6 jag with the 4.2 straight six on carbs - 250bhp! quick ebay trawl has found an ideal donar. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1994-JAGUAR-SOVEREIGN-XJ6-XJ40-4-0-AUTO-BLUE-/270727521992?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item3f089e26c8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 ... AJ6 engine is moderately simple, i think it uses a simillar hotwire system that the rover v8 uses ...! Which surely would have to be squirted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Didn't they do a supercharged one too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Didn't they do a supercharged one too? Yummy, 320BHP straight six, whining supercharger.... a mate had one of the first XJRs, very very quick in a car weighing ~2.5 tons, would be pretty scary in a LR! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huff Posted April 2, 2011 Author Share Posted April 2, 2011 Hey gents, Sorry I haven't been back sooner. Thanks for all your suggestions. I have measured and looked into this a bit further. Looks like if I start to do any of the mods I will end up loosing the vehicles ID including getting it SVA'd etc... D'oH Ah well. What I will look to do is to put a 3.5 or 3.9 onto the standard gearbox (Squirted of course!!) and just run it as standard. However the agricultural mean machine still sounds tempting :-). I will have to contend to let my mate drive his type R like a loon (like spending money on tyres by leaving it all over the carpark!!) I did however challenge him to a tug-of-war.... For some strange reason he bulked at the idea?!? Can't understand why... Thanks anyway guys. N Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexi Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 Best way with new chassis and a modified vehicle is to get a new bare metal chassis..............do all the mods then galvanise. Can weld all sorts on first without grinding zinc or breathing it in from welding fumes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Thanks for all your suggestions. I have measured and looked into this a bit further. Looks like if I start to do any of the mods I will end up loosing the vehicles ID including getting it SVA'd etc... D'oH Which mods are you talking about here? Seems a bit extreme for an engine & box swap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 I did however challenge him to a tug-of-war.... For some strange reason he bulked at the idea?!? Can't understand why... I broke my first ever diff in my 88" late on a Friday night, while coasting through town centre traffic lights Another mate who was with me offered to give me a tow home with his XR2 Fiesta Now he couldn't even get the Landy rolling without two more guys leaning on the back of it, but we did make it home The folk staggering out of the pub were rather confused to say the least, to see a Fiesta towing a Landy Can't imagine why Type R man won't give you a tug 'o' war Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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