landroversforever Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 I wonder if it's worth an add up of stuff like sheet material usage in the fit-out. Try and get an idea of weight you're adding to the box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 24 minutes ago, miketomcat said: Realistically anyone who thinks they are overlanding with a trailer is deluded as it's simply not practical Well, you could make it a driven axle, powered via the Ibex. Power takeoff, Landrover back axle ( unless you want a steering axle ) = six wheel drive...... Stop you from getting too bored..... Regards Stephen 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 Just now, Stellaghost said: Well, you could make it a driven axle, powered via the Ibex. Power takeoff, Landrover back axle ( unless you want a steering axle ) = six wheel drive...... Stop you from getting too bored..... Regards Stephen You'd have that knocked out by tea time! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 I've found the weight of a trailer matters less than the aerodynamics of it - all else being equal. Weight only causes issues with starting & stopping, whereas a big tall & wide box trailer or wobbly caravan is far worse to tow than a gert big heavy plant trailer or robust-but-small box trailer. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted January 30, 2023 Author Share Posted January 30, 2023 Aerodywhat you do realise this will be towed behind the ibex don't you. The interior will be fairly sparce, king sized bed, a pair of bunks and toilet/shower cubical. We found if you have seating inside you tend to be more antisocial than I am already. So external kitchen with awning and a wood burner. It will have a built in water tank, heating and hot water. I have a 35ltr waeco fridge but we may use a different one and a gas stove. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 Is there mileage in starting with a caravan as a donor? Not just for the frame, but things like a fridge, kitchen, windows and a door etc. Like this one: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/134429626956?hash=item1f4ca1524c:g:nrsAAOSwn7Nj1WLD&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAkHI3hIOQCzW3Q3hFIBJKEmxiMGBZlLMBOHQgMslHnaedG6wHCZk7XzPAlr8SbA3Z8qlaYUuen8u6A2luyfO%2BiKDunuTRWc1ecVX1%2FhokjPUcEZ0wOxbZOIEDsAzE0pvKkHB3cQXS3oCesfvlwPzuFHmv64a7p4tL0PetIhgCkFifCYAcm%2BMTdnFxK19loBC%2FGw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR6ipnLbAYQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 5 minutes ago, Daan said: Is there mileage in starting with a caravan as a donor? Not just for the frame, but things like a fridge, kitchen, windows and a door etc. Like this one: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/134429626956?hash=item1f4ca1524c:g:nrsAAOSwn7Nj1WLD&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAkHI3hIOQCzW3Q3hFIBJKEmxiMGBZlLMBOHQgMslHnaedG6wHCZk7XzPAlr8SbA3Z8qlaYUuen8u6A2luyfO%2BiKDunuTRWc1ecVX1%2FhokjPUcEZ0wOxbZOIEDsAzE0pvKkHB3cQXS3oCesfvlwPzuFHmv64a7p4tL0PetIhgCkFifCYAcm%2BMTdnFxK19loBC%2FGw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR6ipnLbAYQ I think you'll run out of weight capacity fairly quickly with a caravan chassis compared to a trailer Older 'vans also tend to have horrific looking appliances in them too 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted January 30, 2023 Author Share Posted January 30, 2023 I don't really have the space and I'm planning to avoid a caravan chassis. I've already got a lot of the kitchen type stuff and more might be coming up at work soon. With the age of the windows they'll either be knackered or inefficient. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 44 minutes ago, Daan said: Is there mileage in starting with a caravan as a donor? Not just for the frame, but things like a fridge, kitchen, windows and a door etc. I've seen it done - most of the stuff in a standard caravan is fairly poor or not worth buying a whole van for, and the materials/furnishings are shockingly flimsy as Mike already knows. There's plenty of caravan breakers who'll sell you a used 3-way fridge or a sink or whatever without a pile of mouldy scrap wood attached. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 I'd be really surprised if you couldn't manage to get something very workable and nice for under 1200Kg tbh. Just got to lay off the marble worktops and ceramic tile wet room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted January 30, 2023 Author Share Posted January 30, 2023 Quite probably, it would be nice to weigh the box but I don't have the ability here. But if you said 350kg for the box plus extension, flat bed trailer another 350kg, one king and two single mattresses 60kg, shower cubical plus cassette toilet 50kg, 5 sheets of ply and some framing timber 100kg, oven, fridge and kitchen stuff etc 70kg, odds and sods 50kg, gives a total of 1040kg. Maybe add 50kg for water tank (full) and 100kg of kit. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 1 hour ago, miketomcat said: Quite probably, it would be nice to weigh the box but I don't have the ability here. But if you said 350kg for the box plus extension, flat bed trailer another 350kg, one king and two single mattresses 60kg, shower cubical plus cassette toilet 50kg, 5 sheets of ply and some framing timber 100kg, oven, fridge and kitchen stuff etc 70kg, odds and sods 50kg, gives a total of 1040kg. Maybe add 50kg for water tank (full) and 100kg of kit. Mike What 12ft flatbed is only 350kg? . Ifor LM is more like double that for a 12footer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted January 30, 2023 Author Share Posted January 30, 2023 19 minutes ago, landroversforever said: What 12ft flatbed is only 350kg? . Ifor LM is more like double that for a 12footer. I don't need the 200kg of buffalo board or the tailgate though. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 38 minutes ago, miketomcat said: I don't need the 200kg of buffalo board or the tailgate though. Mike Fair point! If you built it onto an LM would you mount it permanently then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted January 30, 2023 Author Share Posted January 30, 2023 I don't know yet it would be useful to be demountable but only if it's relatively quick and easy to do. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 More expensive, but what about a tiltbed and winch to get the box on and off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MECCANO Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 Looking forward to seeing this evolve 👍 If you need any measurements for a rapier chassis just shout. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nonimouse Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 Mike, I see where you are coming from. I'm negotiating with James to buy that american folding cravan he has in the yard. Strong and a strong thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted January 31, 2023 Author Share Posted January 31, 2023 1 minute ago, Nonimouse said: Mike, I see where you are coming from. I'm negotiating with James to buy that american folding cravan he has in the yard. Strong and a strong thing. I've seen a few of them in the net now, it's a nice concept and works well just isn't very pretty. At the end of the day I need/want a caravan but nothing on the market fits. Overland is a style more than anything but I want something that doesn't shake itself apart on rough roads. I tend to avoid the troden path and I have in-laws in Bulgaria and the Hebrides, so I want something that will cope with that. Mike 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted January 31, 2023 Author Share Posted January 31, 2023 There's a few things that drive this more than anything. We've had camp systems that take minutes to set up. The current one takes a lot longer, though still quick by others standards . The ability to stop on the side of the road and go to sleep. Sleeping in the car on a long trip isn't fun anymore. Space. Whilst a caravan takes up a large space everything lives inside it and a dehumidifier/heater can be put in if need be. We have camping gear everywhere and the tents/cooking gear have to live in the Sankey which isn't ideal. I'm not getting any younger, I don't sleep well at the best of times and I have a dodgy back. All of the above don't work well with tents. Having two kids and a dog we have to tow a Sankey anyway so why not tow a caravan. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L19MUD Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 13 hours ago, landroversforever said: More expensive, but what about a tiltbed and winch to get the box on and off? I did it with my Luton body by welding box section underneath and then making legs that slide in on each corner with a wind up trailer leg attached. The Luton is probably heavier in the first instance (14ft long) and it normally has 3 kayaks, 3 bikes, fridge, 2 Thule kayak racks and a heavy Thule bike rack in the back and I can easily mount and demount it with that weight in. It sits on the legs 99% of the time and not on the trailer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nonimouse Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 This getting old thing is a PITA. I moved over to a Bell tent for camping, which allows the used of a decent camp bed and the ability to stand up. Brilliant tent, unless it gets wet. Then it's a nightmare. If rain is forecast I take my big quechua. Still a PITA when wet, but at least it doesn't weigh more than the vehicle. My back is shot. Not fixable. So sleeping in a vehicle or camping pod is becoming more and more attractive. I really like the Aliner, but being American is heavy. I looked at an Erde, last time I was up at Nash. The guy had mounted it on a sub chassis and fitted a toyota hi-lux rear axle, so he could run the same tyres as on his 80 series. Loved the little Erde 'van. Ideal for simple 'van camping; but the whole sub chassis and big tyres thing made the ste up impractical and heavy I've often pondered the ex BT rear, from off the Transit work vans... But the cooler wagon back is so easy to heat and stays warm. When James and I converted the TP Chipper to twin axle, I found a supplier in Bridgwater, who sold us two brand new indespenision beam, 1500kg SWL, with braked hubs and LR pcd for £120.00 each (ex VAT)... I'd be tempted to buy a decenct trailer chassis, replace the axles (indespension beams give you more than adequate strength and reasonable ground clearance. There's no point in using a NATO hitch, and some foreign types frown on them. The old Bradley hitch is excellent off tarmac, and it has the manual reversing break lock out, as well as being field srippable with two spanners Edited to say, I meant Eriba, not Erde Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nonimouse Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 I would then look at getting it IVA'd; just so it ticks all the boxes in foreign climes Meant to say, indespension allows for very close coupled axles as they have passive steering under load. That TP is heavy. Proper heavy. It tows like a dream and I can put it anywhere. Using 235/75x16 MT's means it doesnt sink in the soft stuff, but tracks well on the road. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood500 Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 I do a bit moving these boxes around and they aren’t fun to shift, hard work on the truck at speed due to the wind drag as mentioned above. If you are set on going down the box route I’d pay consideration to some aero type mods for the front just to help it along or you may find it to be just too hard work on the road at speed. This was my setup for a run to Southampton today, trailer just under a ton empty and the box with fridge around 700kgs. Downwards trip with the box on was 14mpg at 55mph and wouldn’t pull 6th gear. Any higher speed just felt like too much strain as you were really thrashing it to hold speed, absolutely no issue off the mark upto 40mph then you felt the drag. My D3 is a manual and played with by Alive so isn’t short on go, normally sees 21/22mpg at 60mph+ loaded to max capacity with a more aerodynamic load. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted February 3, 2023 Author Share Posted February 3, 2023 That's interesting, when I picked mine up they loaded it the wrong way round. It was also up on blocks because the step was still attached. All in all it was at least a foot higher than I plan to have it. I didn't take it above 50mph anyway but felt the correct way round, a foot lower and attached to the trailer would be fine. It does have a dipped front (around 200mm lower than the back) and I only have a 200tdi so doubt it'll go above 60mph even if I wanted to. I plan to strip the fridge unit and interior out this weekend so should get a much better idea what I'm dealing with. On a side note I looked up the weight of some other overland caravans. The bruder is 1990kg slightly bigger than ours will be. The direct 4x4 toy hauler/caravan is around 1500kg and roughly the same length and height. Whilst the weights I'm expecting aren't light they do appear to be about right. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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