Twin Axle vs Tri Axle Trailer ?

[discomikey]

Err,

well, a previous load over the same distance 'could' have weighed 4.0 and a little bit Tons + the trailer. Couple in some 300 miles at 'speed' on the motorway and the tyres 'may' have been operated outside thier design limits....

Personally I'd preffer a triaxle to have the factor of saftey. 'If' I were to be over the weight limit for due to the additional axle weight and be accidentally caught by the police I would see the fine as a small price for a factor of safety on the tyres.

Adrian

you are forgetting that (Assuming) we are on about say.. a 14ft flatbed for example. whats wrong with buying a 12ft tri instead of 14ft twin.

youre weight will be brought back down by around 100kg to compensate for the extra axle. and lets face it... what can you not fit on a 12ft that you can on a 14ft? dont say something thats 13 ft long...

[wack61]

Since this thread was started things have changed regarding towing for business

If you tow for hire or reward you now need an operators licence

if you operate as a courier or move goods that aren't yours, ie cars you now fall in this O licence group

As I understand it if you're moving your own goods you don't , the requirement for O licences for trailers weighing over 1020kg unladen hasn't changed

Something that should be taken into account when buying large tri axle trailers

[discomikey]

can you please enlighten me on the operators liscence. i was under the impression that as long as you were appropriately liscenced (which i thought was just B+E), and insured to tow for hire or reward, you were okay?

what will it cost me? this is the first ive heard of it, so im guessing it was something recent that has been quietly brought into effect in order to get yet more of our hard earned money?

[ejparrott]

Which would mean, you can't go and pick up a project for a friend who hasn't got an E license......

[discomikey]

ive looked into it, and if im right, i would have to pay 6200 a year? plus have my truck checked up every 6 weeks by a registered garage...

i think the fine for not having one would be a better route to take haha

[CwazyWabbit]

Which would mean, you can't go and pick up a project for a friend who hasn't got an E license......

You could if they gave the project to you (with a receipt) before the move and you gave it back to them afterwards..... They could sit in the towing vehicle the whole time holding the receipt if they were precious about it

[ejparrott]

I'm glad I've done my test then...should I buy another vehicle that needs towing back at least I can get it back myself!

Thats assuming it comes under the all up weight limit of The 109 of course.....

[=jon=]

Which would mean, you can't go and pick up a project for a friend who hasn't got an E license......

My understanding was that you can't move other peoples stuff for cash - so if your friend was paying you to move their project you would need special insurance, possibly a tachygraph etc same as a commercial driver would.

If it means I can't shift something on a trailer something as a favour for a friend, that's ridiculous!

[ejparrott]

Ah! a loophole!

[discomikey]

loophole where? i was looking for a "farmer" get out clause. but a lot of my towing work isnt just for farms, but for other poeple too.

[ejparrott]

it would appear then, don't do it for money, then you don't come under hire or reward

[wack61]

It's business use, if you're moving friends cars that's not business use

There is also a dual purpose vehicle exemption that might apply to defenders but you'd need to research that yourself

There's some info on the NTTA site

http://www.ntta.co.uk/news/news_details.aspx?NewsID=17

[wack61]

It doesn't cost £6200 a year

I've just been through it, if your moving other people's goods for money and you don't qualify for the exemption you need an O licence

This means you'll need a certificate of professional competence in road transport (CPC) or employ somebody who has one

You'll need premises that'll need to be approved by vosa, a garage to do the checks, mine is 10 weekly

It cost me around £1000 for a 5 year licence, luckily for me I did my CPC 15 years ago( not driver CPC that's something different)

[ejparrott]

CPC...thats the thing where you have to do so many hours every five years in a classroom isn't it?

[madmatt]

CPC...thats the thing where you have to do so many hours every five years in a classroom isn't it?

Thats driver CPC not operator CPC two completely different mine fields!

[ejparrott]

ah, understood!

[discomikey]

thanks for clearing that up. its still a lot of money though!

[gordonwilly]

I have a heavy twin v8 engined (therefore back heavy) 26' sports boat on a Snipe triple axle trailer with 165 x 13 wheels and tyres. I tow it with a 110 TD5 CSW. Manouvering in tight spots is a pain, but towing is a dream. It just sits there a behaves, even in foul weather, heavy cross winds and pouring rain.

I also think that, although maintenance is more expensive, on long trips to the South of France, six tyres, six wheel bearings, six brakes etc will run cooler, etc than four (again I may be wrong, but it's the feeling I get). Each trip I stop after an hour and check the load etc, which includes checking tyres and bearings...and they're always running cool.

Even sitting on six decent sized 165 x 13 tyres you can see the trailer has some considerable weight on it!!

I wouldn't trust a twin axle trailer with a big boat sitting on top if I were towing for a big disctance (though I haven't tried it so I may be wrong).

[Arjan]

Oh well.... Let's have a Dutchman say something....

Having towed almost anything everywhere I was always a bit weary for 3 axle trailers. However, since buying both a Hulco 3-axle 3.5 MAM (2.800 kgs. payload) and a 2-axle Saris tipping trailer (3.5 MAM (2.705 kgs. payload) we can compare head to head...

The 3-axle is really good for longer distances and heavy loads. Very stable, very much self carrying and in less need for nose weight as a twin axle. But you need to experiment with loading.

The underdeck tires really need 6.5 Bar and I have had no problems to get them at various places in the UK for around 60 ukp. We have the 13" tires filled with Nitrogen and it does make a difference as we like to tow at speed and they do run a bit hotter than the 14" ones under the tipper. Under inflated tires are the main reason for punctures with these small ones.

We carry a very high pressure bottle with Nitrogen for this purpose as most pumps do not make it to 6.5 Bar and you end up with just not enough pressure in them.

Reversing with both is easy. I like the 6 tyres for having a blow out and still have a few left. Emtpy, they both are around 800-900 kgs. so they behave well. Pushing them around is for both not an option.

As I have all licences, towing is never a problem but we do have interesting discussions from time to time with various people in uniform who think they know better.... However, I make living out of transport paperwork so most of the times.....

Both trailers needs money for maintenance etc. We have spare tyres we carry and they are parked out of the sun (quite important here) on concrete standing with sand on it to make turning less difficult.

[qwakers]

[mathewd]

I know this post is from a while back and I don't mean to start up the whole debate as such.

 

But I'm in the middle of ordering a Transport Trailer, having narrowed it down to a Brian James Trailer.

I appreciate it's not necessarily Land Rover related but I trust there will be more experienced trailers users here than anywhere else.

 

The dilemma is as before, Twin or Triple Axle???

 

It has been suggested that the triple is much more stable when towing heavy weight, it has also been suggested that it is, in fact, easier to manoeuvre with a triple (Not that twin is difficult) which is contrary to some previous comments, it has been noted, however, that triples do tend to scrub tyres much quicker. 

 

These are the trailers that I've narrowed down to. (FYI - The largest vehicle I'll be carrying is a Range Rover, but mostly Audi,s BMW's and Discovery Sports )

FYI - The wheels are 10" on triple and 12" on the twin if that makes a difference 

 

http://www.brianjames.co.uk/range/range_details.aspx?id=&rid=45 - T6 TRANSPORTER - 230-6552 or T4 TRANSPORTER 230-6443

 

http://www.brianjames.co.uk/pdf/T4T6TRANSUK2019_Q1_2_1.pdf

__________________________________________________________________________________________________________

http://www.brianjames.co.uk/range/range_details.aspx?id=&rid=6  - 180-2000

 

http://www.brianjames.co.uk/pdf/HMAXUK2019_Q1_1_1_1.pdf

 

Any thoughts, opinions and suggestion are very welcome.

[Blanco]

Well FWIW, my experience is that small wheels and tyres are fragile compared to larger wheels and tyres. If the trailers under consideration have the same size then it is more  a matter of personal choice,  but small tyres are always sensitive to being forced sideways (reversing and turning),  there is some evidence to suggest that three axles helps there because they reduce the load per tyre and therefore the stress.   Also remember that generally speaking it means the difference between 3 pairs of 8" brakes or 2 pairs of 10" brakes, which doesn't matter at all until something breaks or needs replacing.

I think tri-axle is best for high motorway mileage and twins make better general purpose trailers, but  10, 12, and 13 inch wheels can be expensive on tyres. 14 and 16 inch  generally last better.

[L19MUD]

The smaller wheels gets the load down lower which is always good

I changed from a 2 axle ifor to a 3 axle Bateson and would never ever go back. Took a 90 on a 100 mile trip the other day on the back of the l322 in foul weather and it towed perfectly 

[Cynic-al]

When I looked at swapping my 2 axle for a 3 axle some time ago some things stood out to me so may or may not be relevant to you;

• Tyre scrubbing is not a problem from the point of view that I have never worn out a trailer or caravan tyre. They always get swapped due to punctures or wall cracking with age. I just don't do the miles. 
• More axles = more servicing but generally for the miles I do it's only greasing bearings etc so not a massive issue most of the time. 
• Although they are only legally limited to 3.5 tonne gross so less available payload, if you look at the axle weights they're rated at something like 4.5 tonne compared to a 2 axle at something like 3.6 tonne so you have more of a safety margin which is handy for a puncture etc. 
• Generally they have smaller wheels so a lower bed which is good for loading and on road stability, not so good if you go offroad. It also means your wheels and bearings are turning faster so everything gets hotter. 
• I've bent the suspension units in the past on both my caravan and trailer. No idea how, the guy that serviced the caravan suggested he saw a lot of it and it was caused by potholes / poor condition roads. I wonder if a 3 axle would ride over potholes better as the weight is more spread out or would it make it worse - do they use axles that are a bit smaller and weaker and there's less rubber in the tyre would they be more susceptible to damage?
• A 3 axle is more inclined to want to go straight so your tow vehicle has to be meaty enough to not be bullied by it. 

If I was buying a trailer again I would look to get an old fashioned leaf sprung Ifor because of the problems I've had with the suspension units. 

 

[Simon_CSK]

For towing my Land Rover or Range Rover I have an Ifor CT177 which is twin axle with a very low bed. Towed this all over the place with either a P38 or a Disco 2 on the back and haven't had any issues. Very comfortable to tow. 

My brother, who moves vehicles commercially, uses a twin axle which has a very high bed towed by a Nissan Cabstar crew cab to avoid the Operators Licence issue. He sometimes borrows my trailer when he doesn't need the load capacity on his trailer. (His trailer is long enough to take 2 cars.)