Quagmire Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 As the title really, can anyone make a recommendation on a good fire extinguisher to carry in your rover? As I am due to start messing about with adding EFi to my 90 soon I think now would be a good time to get one... So any suggestions on what size to go for, any that mount particularly nicely/neatly (or not), etc? Obvious criteria are: - Must be large enough to actually do something useful with it before it runs out. - Must be able to mount it somewhere where it can be reached easily and quickly. - Must be able to mount it securely but in a such a way it can be released quickly. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 fire extinguisher minimum size 2kg, ABC dry powder type like this one or you could go for a 6kg, but that would need to be stored in the rear of the vehicle just inside the rear door & securely strapped in place, for any dry powder extinguisher, they compact the powder when in transit, so roitate it upside down a few times to unsettle the powder, otherwise it won't be any use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zardos Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 MSA requires a minimum of 1.75l AFFF for motorsport vehicles. Get one from your local fire extinguisher place not Halfords, that way you can have it regularly serviced and inspected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 MSA requires a minimum of 1.75l AFFF for motorsport vehicles. Get one from your local fire extinguisher place not Halfords, that way you can have it regularly serviced and inspected. MSA Blue book says this 3.1.1. Small, Hand operated. 3.1.2. (a) Medium, Plumbed-In, for discharge into both cockpit and engine compartment. (b) Medium, Hand-Operated, for discharge into both cockpit and engine compartment. 3.1.3. Large, Plumbed-In, for discharge into both cockpit and engine compartment. 3.1.4. Large, Plumbed-In, for discharge into Engine compartment, plus Medium, Hand-Held for Driver or Rally Co-driver use. 3.1.5. Hand-operated for cockpit (International) doesn't mention size by weight at all. my rented 9kg dry powder from Chubb is £68 per year, this includes annual service & refills if partly or fully used,I have this as part of my MSA recovery kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJB Serenity Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 This is one of those things that I know I have got to get around to buying but until someone mentions it, or until something bad happens, isn't really at the front of my mind. Will add an alarm to my iPhone to remind me to buy one on pay day methinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zardos Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 MSA Blue book says this 3.1.1. Small, Hand operated. 3.1.2. (a) Medium, Plumbed-In, for discharge into both cockpit and engine compartment. (b) Medium, Hand-Operated, for discharge into both cockpit and engine compartment. 3.1.3. Large, Plumbed-In, for discharge into both cockpit and engine compartment. 3.1.4. Large, Plumbed-In, for discharge into Engine compartment, plus Medium, Hand-Held for Driver or Rally Co-driver use. 3.1.5. Hand-operated for cockpit (International) doesn't mention size by weight at all. my rented 9kg dry powder from Chubb is £68 per year, this includes annual service & refills if partly or fully used,I have this as part of my MSA recovery kit. Yes it does, just many pages down See page 20 of http://www.msauk.org/uploadedfiles/msa_forms/bluebooks/11/152-190%20Competitor%20Safety.pdf Minimum quantity of extinguishant (3) Reference Description AFFF ZERO 2000 3.1.1 Small, hand-operated 1.75 litres N/A 3.1.2(a) Medium, plumbed-in, for discharge into both cockpit 2.25 litres 2.25 litres and engine compartment 3.1.2(b) Medium, hand-operated, for discharge into both cockpit 1.75 litres N/A and engine compartment 3.1.3 Large, plumbed-in, for discharge into both cockpit and engine 2.25 litres 2.25 litres compartment 3.1.4 (plumbed) Large, plumbed-in, for discharge into engine compartment 2.25 litres 2.25 litres 3.1.4 (hand-held) Medium, hand-held for Driver or Rally Co-Driver use 1.75 litres N/A 3.1.5 Hand-operated for cockpit (International) 2.4 litres N/A My local fire place charges about £20 to buy a 1.75l AFFF with free inspection and £15 for a recharge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 Ah, so it does, actually on page 171 table 3 of the link above, AFFF is just as messy as dry powder & dry powder can be used on any fire if it's the ABC type. extracted from the page 14.1.4. Fire Extinguishers. Even small extinguishers carried in a vehicle can extinguish or contain fires before they develop seriously. Minimum recommendation is for a 1.75 litre AFFF extinguisher or equivalent with BS4123/EN3 approval (EN3 minimum size is 2 litre AFFF) and a rating of at least 34B. More sophisticated equipment is required in many events and full vehicle systems are highly recommended (see 3). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landmannnn Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 Hard to get, but a bcf type is what you need to put out unleaded petrol fires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 Yup, BCF or 'Halon'. Illegal (CFC), come in a green (usually) cylinder and can sometimes be bought at car boots, under the counter at autojumbles etc., and are an effective fire fighting measure - better than powder, AFFF etc. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landmannnn Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 Yup, BCF or 'Halon'. Illegal (CFC), come in a green (usually) cylinder and can sometimes be bought at car boots, under the counter at autojumbles etc., and are an effective fire fighting measure - better than powder, AFFF etc. Chris They are actually compulsory for aircraft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 BCF & Halon ONLY legal for aircraft now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 Mate of mine races Has x 2 1 x AFFF for getting through scrutineering, 1 x Halon (painted rad ) for putting out a fire Halon or Zero 360 are best, BCF after that- I have PERSONALLY seen 2 x AFFF fail in last 10 months Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 Avoid powder- I have personal experience of why! AFFF work Ok, so long as the extinguisher itself actually functions. Halon / Zero 360 and the other replacements work the best. There is a reason Halon is permitted on Aircraft - simply that it has the best chance of working and usually your life depends on it! Having experienced putting out a fuel fire in my workshop recently I found that AFFF ( first go) was ineffective. CO2 was better - but tended just to move the flame front around. Finally the emergency, all else fails, Halon - put it out immediately. The fire was caused by a blob of weld melting a hole in a can of White spirit which emptied itself under my bench. A second blob of weld then turned my bench into Vietnam! Even if you stash it out of sight - it's worth carrying a small cylinder of Halon and only use it if everything else fails. Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the real muddy90 Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 I'm lucky to have a fire officer in our club who aquired my afff extingiusher & services it for me I seem to remember him saying Haylon is best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 I work in an environment that is at high risk from fire - and my life (and the rest of the crew) depend on our ability to deal with it. My extinguishing medium of choice would be AFFF in a fire extinguisher - BUT, you need to know how to apply it to various type of fire. Just pointing and squirting at an oil fire won't do squat. CO2 won't do much to an oil fire either and powder just makes a mess. If you get the chance - do a basic fire fighting course. It's surprising what the limitations of various extinguishers are, and if you use the wrong one in the wrong manner, then your fire isn't going out! It's also quite easy to service fire extinguishers yourself - I'm sure there are guides on line. I'd always do it myself now as I'm more confident in my ability than that of someone unknown to me. I'd have thought that line of thinking would apply to many on here. (I'll just add to that - I have no experience of Halon...but I'd imagine it's very effective) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 IKEA do a very nice powder for £20 odd. Fits in the footwell nicely. Looks exactly like Western link. Guage and all. It might not be the best choice but its cheap enough to get two of them. At the price of a Halon i'd expect someone to come and put the fire out for me ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazelle Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 Just remember that the powder from powder extinguishers is highly corrosive, and will tend to take out any electrics/electronics. Engines will need a fast and thorough clean, including the insides which may pick up the corrosive powder from the inlet and plaster it all around the innards. Better that loosing the whole truck, but still not great.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pwyll Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 Just remember that the powder from powder extinguishers is highly corrosive, and will tend to take out any electrics/electronics. Engines will need a fast and thorough clean, including the insides which may pick up the corrosive powder from the inlet and plaster it all around the innards. Better that loosing the whole truck, but still not great.. And, whatever you do, don't ingest any. If you do, you'll soon realise how uncomfortable your toilet seat is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 I went on a fire safety course with a previous employer in the early 90's - which was very revealing. At the time, we only had water, CO2 and a halon flood suppression system so didn't cover AFFF or powder. What I can remember of the course has probably saved a lot of damage by being competent at putting fires out. If you have the opportunity - do a course. It was quite good fun too - lots of setting fire to stuff and destruction! Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Yeah i did one with AFFF powder and water. The AFFF was the flavour of the day as long as the brass spray attachment was still there. Good for 25K volts....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean f Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I have to do a survival course every few years which involves fire fighting, how to use different types of extinguisher and what to use in different cases is all covered along with practice with each type on various fires. There is a new extinguisher for fat fires which is very impressive although expensive so meant for commercial applications. We also cover now to find you way out of a smoke filled room with a smoke hood or a full BA on, we used to do this with real fires (straw bales) but now they use fake smoke apparently for enviromental reasons not as much fun though. Always enjoyed the fire fighting section, never liked the under water sections though, being strapped into a seat dunked underwater and turned upside down then having to remove a window, undo a harness and swim out the window whilst holding your breath is not fun as far as I am concerned, especially as over the years I have had to be rescued by the safety divers twice when the harness has jammed (yes I did start to panic when it failed to release for the third time). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Sean - on the BOSIET, they now use fake smoke as you say in the fire training it used to be real. I did my refresher in february and froze my arse off ! The fireteam member which is a week still use real fire ! Our Halon systems at work have been removed and replaced with water mist systems. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tacr2man Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Speaking as ex firefighter (14yrs) the most critical part of the operation is the knowledge of what and how to use . Any fire needs to be attacked as soon as and as efficiently as possible , so try and do a course if you can arrange . A plumbed in system would be excellent as it enables a very quick reaction , the area is enclosed , so restricts the available oxygen , and enables flooding the area with extinguishant . A handheld in cabin gives you flexibility if fire is other than in precovered areas. Halon/bcf is illegal for use other than in aviation, but is/was extremely effective. Powder is very corrosive esp to alloy , but far less damaging than fire in the end. As mentioned it also has compaction problems when used on machinery/ subject to vibration. This problem is not insurmountable though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean f Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Sean - on the BOSIET, they now use fake smoke as you say in the fire training it used to be real. I did my refresher in february and froze my arse off ! The fireteam member which is a week still use real fire ! Our Halon systems at work have been removed and replaced with water mist systems. G As you have quesses I was describing the BOSIET, doubt if any one else has to go through all that for work. Last refresher was out at Alterns which was quite civilised, the previous one was at Petans behind the airport, that was the full week course as I had to upgrade to the full european version which is where the harness jammed which was not pleasant. I am a service hand so don't do the full fire team course as I bounce from rig to rig but even the reduced fire course I found usefull and interesting. As said the knowledge of what to do and just as importantly what not to do is critical. Watched a car engine fire in a service station a few years ago and the driver was trying to open the bonnet to tackle the fire, what the big gush of fresh air would have done to the car or to him as he was stood in front wouldn't have been good. Fortunately a lorry driver grapped his extinguisher stuffed the nozzle under the edge of the bonnet and let the whole cylinder go into the engine bay which put the fire out, doubt if it saved the car but probable did save the cars parked around it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
q-rover Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 I get to play with fire (put it out) as part of the offshore survival course I have to do for work. The worst I have had to tackle is a gas fire from a 1/2" pipe. That was scary. A firefighting course on the proper use of the various types of extinguisher would be excellent. maybe if a club approched the local firebrigade, they may help. Watermist would be a good one for vehicle fires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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