steve b Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 49 minutes ago, Stellaghost said: I get where your going with that how much more length does an adjustable pan hard rod give or are we talking custom made ?? Regards Stephen I was thinking make a new one , but initially just a very basic simple light test set up - it still needs to be central to the chassis rails so if 300mm out from chassis to axle mount then the same out to the chassis mount point , and as Doug says some sort of rose joint either end will reduce any binding . Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous doug Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 If we’re talking about re making stuff….wouldnt a watts linkage be more appropriate for a 1-link? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 I'm interested to see how it lasts but I've had zero issues cycling my 3 link which has a totally stock panhard with standard rubber bushes. The only little bit of binding is when the axle gets dropped out but kept level. 22 minutes ago, steve b said: I was thinking make a new one , but initially just a very basic simple light test set up - it still needs to be central to the chassis rails so if 300mm out from chassis to axle mount then the same out to the chassis mount point , and as Doug says some sort of rose joint either end will reduce any binding . Steve If Stephen is keeping the steering geometry the same, then sticking with the standard panhard rod layout will be the best option and not induce any bump steer on the road. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 15 minutes ago, dangerous doug said: If we’re talking about re making stuff….wouldnt a watts linkage be more appropriate for a 1-link? Interesting thought. I guess you'd run into clearance issues with the crank pulley at full bump? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbekko Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 A Watts would keep the axle from moving side to side, and introduce a bunch of bump steer, just like a triangulated 4-link would. A panhard bar parallel to the drop link is the best solution here. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Yup, as above, the panhard and drag link closely situated for a good reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 Will need to fab something up I think, not cycled the front as yet but diff housing's possibly going to be in the way not much I can do at the moment as currently in A&E getting a piece of Sid removed from my eye.. the joys regards Stephen 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 1 hour ago, landroversforever said: If Stephen is keeping the steering geometry the same, then sticking with the standard panhard rod layout will be the best option and not induce any bump steer on the road. If the panhard rod is symmetrically mounted and parallel to the drag link an increase in length will not add bump steer as I understand it . Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 You might get lucky with the clearance bend in it! But it is fairly close with my axle. Take care of your eyes! Hopefully you had some protection on (although I have had stuff bounce in with them on) Just now, steve b said: If the panhard rod is symmetrically mounted and parallel to the drag link an increase in length will not add bump steer as I understand it . Steve It needs to be a similar length or it will induce bump steer when it moves in a different arc to the drag link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 4 minutes ago, landroversforever said: (although I have had stuff bounce in with them on) This^^ regards Stephen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 28 minutes ago, landroversforever said: It needs to be a similar length or it will induce bump steer when it moves in a different arc to the drag link. Theory and application On the road the minimal axle travel vertically would have negligible effect on bump steer with a longer PR , however , the longer rod in off-road deflection will reduce the sideways movement of the axle relative to the chassis making packaging the suspension a bit easier. It's not like we are discussing a top group Dakar racer is it ? Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, steve b said: Theory and application On the road the minimal axle travel vertically would have negligible effect on bump steer with a longer PR , however , the longer rod in off-road deflection will reduce the sideways movement of the axle relative to the chassis making packaging the suspension a bit easier. It's not like we are discussing a top group Dakar racer is it ? Steve It will still move it differently in relation to the drag link. It doesn't take much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Stellaghost said: This^^ regards Stephen Been there, visor and goggles and still managed to get a fleck of something in there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 3 hours ago, landroversforever said: It will still move it differently in relation to the drag link. It doesn't take much! What happens when the drag link is longer than the PR ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous doug Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 It will be at a different angle at full droop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Will it induce bump/drop steer then ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 I think we are trying to reinvent the wheel here, from this preliminary cycling travel looks ample and if this vehicle can't deform/deflect bushes there's no hope for the rest of us! Feel for you with the eye I did nearly a week with bits of paint in last year and I was climbing the walls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 2 hours ago, muddy said: Feel for you with the eye I did nearly a week with bits of paint in last year and I was climbing the walls. Ahhh, that's the other part of the story So had a piece of metal removed from my right cornea and then the rust it had generated removed with a medical rotary burr ( whoa burrs rip metal as apart !!! ) metal has been in there for 6 days ( no wonder I couldn't sleep ) I have now invested in some side protection things for my glasses and a full face screen just need to train the idiot in me to use them... Lesson learnt.. Regards Stephen 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 6 hours ago, steve b said: It's not like we are discussing a top group Dakar racer is it ? Steve Agreed... More like something out of Mad Max....... Regards Stephen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 So when I start cycling ( suspension, not that hard work looking thing) would it pay to fit the drag link as well regards Stephen Edit Would drag link also benefit from rose joints. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Stellaghost said: Agreed... More like something out of Mad Max....... Regards Stephen I didn't want to say so , but yeah Just as a point of interest , the std PR is about 820mm centres and the std drag link about 930mm so I still feel there is scope to extend the PR without dramatically affecting road manners which I'd assume will be about 0.5% of time in use ( I hope ) Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Oh , also the rusty gunge removal was great work from your NHS local , if left it can cause big problems. Glad you're mending from it now Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 20 minutes ago, steve b said: I didn't want to say so, but yeah Steve Don't be shy with your comments.......no one else is... I'm also virtually impossible to insult...... Regards Stephen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CwazyWabbit Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 59 minutes ago, Stellaghost said: Ahhh, that's the other part of the story So had a piece of metal removed from my right cornea and then the rust it had generated removed with a medical rotary burr ( whoa burrs rip metal as apart !!! ) metal has been in there for 6 days ( no wonder I couldn't sleep ) I have now invested in some side protection things for my glasses and a full face screen just need to train the idiot in me to use them... Lesson learnt.. Regards Stephen The last one I had removed I only spotted because of the rust ring that developed after a few days, the kind lady scraped it out with a needle as it had healed over. They didn't use a burr or anything to remove the rust, they just left that and it disappeared after a while. Is the die grinding your eyeball a new thing they've started doing? The worst part of the whole thing was the cream they gave you to put in your eye for the following week, left a horrible taste in your mouth afterwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 52 minutes ago, CwazyWabbit said: The last one I had removed I only spotted because of the rust ring that developed after a few days, the kind lady scraped it out with a needle as it had healed over. They didn't use a burr or anything to remove the rust, they just left that and it disappeared after a while. Is the die grinding your eyeball a new thing they've started doing? The worst part of the whole thing was the cream they gave you to put in your eye for the following week, left a horrible taste in your mouth afterwards. Never had the die grinder before and I've had metal removed from my eye at least 7 times in my life and boy are you right about the cream, a distinctly unpleasant taste... Regards Stephen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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