landroversforever Posted January 27, 2019 Share Posted January 27, 2019 1 hour ago, Ed Poore said: That's what everyone thought, even Ashcrofts at the time. Turns out Nige is a bit stubborn and doesn't think like everyone else . It is a blooming tight fit though. He'd done a trial with a 4 pin before and I've got his first pegged short nose Ashlocker. He did say it is a little scary taking a brand new shiny locker from the packaging and then putting it straight in the lathe... Ashcrofts still honour the warranty because it's been done by him but I've had no need to try it. Nige is a bit special 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted January 27, 2019 Share Posted January 27, 2019 52 minutes ago, landroversforever said: Nige is a bit special 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted January 27, 2019 Author Share Posted January 27, 2019 Good job Barker is ill and not paying attention Well, the first one is now built up into my old front diff, so will have to bite the bullet and get it swapped out in the near future. The back one is a bit more of a pain because I don't have a spare short nose diff lying around, so it will have to be fitted into the diff that's still in the vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Escape Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 For the record, Ashcroft just supplied me with 2 pegged airlockers for my P38, so also in a short nose housing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 On 1/27/2019 at 1:37 PM, Ed Poore said: That's what everyone thought, even Ashcrofts at the time. Turns out Nige is a bit stubborn and doesn't think like everyone else . It is a blooming tight fit though. He'd done a trial with a 4 pin before and I've got his first pegged short nose Ashlocker. He did say it is a little scary taking a brand new shiny locker from the packaging and then putting it straight in the lathe... Ashcrofts still honour the warranty because it's been done by him but I've had no need to try it. Picture? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Poore Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 Facebook won't let me copy the link on my phone but if you go to his Facebook page (Xcess4x4.com) then have a look at his photo albums there's an album entitled P38 / 110 Short Nose Diff Build. The only photo I have is of my diff guard 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Poore Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 Finally found a link I could share: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BogMonster Posted October 10, 2019 Author Popular Post Share Posted October 10, 2019 Finally ... all done! I splashed out in the end, because it's the vehicle I use for 'going where nobody has been for a long time' trips, which if something broke would generally involve a very long walk. It (my trusty 300Tdi) has also still only got 35,000 miles from new, so I decided it was worth investing. Final shopping list ended up being two ATBs, a full set of Ashcroft CVs, shafts and drive members, and after a bit of thought and "what the hell" I ordered a fully built up and pegged P38 rear diff (with an ATB in) from that Mr Barker that pops up on here occasionally. The front was the original 2 pin diff fitted to the vehicle when new, which had broken its 2 pin centre years ago, that was dragged out from under the bench, polished up and I fitted the new ATB centre. Because it's easier in a proper workshop, I wanted them fitted, and I don't have a lot of tinker time, the whole lot was then fitted at a garage a few weeks back. First impressions - the diffs haven't really been tested in anger yet but I like them. Steering effect is 'noticeable' but just different - and may loosen up with a bit of use. I've just come back from a 300 mile or so trip, most of which was gravel roads and off road, and you just adapt to driving it like you adapt to driving a vehicle with raised suspension where the steering doesn't quite feel the same, and very quickly you don't even think about it except when you get in from another vehicle. Off road, I haven't tried them in very tough conditions yet but faffing around on steep, loose or undulating slopes, the difference with the ATB is considerable. With diff lock in, it just goes up. Diff lock out, on the sort of grassy incline that would spin a front wheel out almost immediately on a standard vehicle, it still goes up. If you provoke it, the fronts will break traction but they'll work at it, and it almost feels like traction control trying to stop the wheels spinning. Any sort of slope where there is loose rock or undulations that would set off a front wheel spinning (usually followed by the opposite rear) - no problems. Sometimes you hear a slight gear noise (which I assume is the diff centre working) but it carries on with almost no wheelspin at all. I haven't figured out how much differential wheel speed is needed to activate the diff centre but it would appear very little - you never get aggressive wheelspin of the sort that you need to activate ETC for example. Cresting a cross-axle, the sort of thing where opposite corners would unload and spin out, it just doesn't. It's all rather like just having Velcro on the tyres. So far - I like them a lot, and especially because they're always there and working. It definitely looks like the right choice for 'real world off road use' - I suspect it wouldn't be for trials/competition where half the day is spent with wheels off the ground and a full locker would be superior. Now, an ATB with a full locker also built in ... would go in my Ibex one day After the late decision on the rear diff, I also now have a spare ATB, and just need to decide what to put it in 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo Murphy Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 Nice to read a real world opinion on ATBs, Stephen, thanks. Mo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Escape Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 All sounds very good! For allround driving and getting there, you probably can't do much better than an ATB. And I was thinking exactly the same thing as you: an ATB with on-command full lock would be so sweet! Much like the ATB centre Ashcroft offers for the LT230. Filip 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 I have an ATB in the back of mine and I love it - totally forget its there and then I find it’s working 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted October 11, 2019 Author Share Posted October 11, 2019 2 hours ago, Anderzander said: I have an ATB in the back of mine and I love it - totally forget its there and then I find it’s working 🙂 Did you go for the shafts as well or are you running standard? I have a spare ATB centre and now a spare rear diff, but I don't really want to fork out for another full set of bits for the other vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 50 minutes ago, BogMonster said: Did you go for the shafts as well or are you running standard? I have a spare ATB centre and now a spare rear diff, but I don't really want to fork out for another full set of bits for the other vehicle. I can't see a problem running an ATB on standard shafts. I ran with the rear ARB locker on standard shafts for a while without any breakages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 I can’t imagine rear shafts having any issues with ATBs. Front 24-32 is what I’m worried about, as the CV end is very narrow. Nige’s video shows it well. I’d like to put a pair of these ATBs in my 95 RRC when I can carry on with its rebuild, but doing the shafts, cvs and stub axles too might be a bit pricey. The rear will definitely get one and keep the standard shafts, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 9 hours ago, BogMonster said: Did you go for the shafts as well or are you running standard? I have a spare ATB centre and now a spare rear diff, but I don't really want to fork out for another full set of bits for the other vehicle. Just the Atb in mine and it’s been in for just under 5 years. I do drive with a lot of mechanical sympathy - but it’s definitely been worked without issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted October 11, 2019 Author Share Posted October 11, 2019 Thanks, that's what I thought. I think it'll get put in the wife's 110 with std shafts, as I now have a pair of spare original shafts anyway. Might stop some of the grumbling that I've got the toys while she is the one that drives off road the most 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peaklander Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 Hope you don't mind a numpty question @BogMonster, I have a 110 TDi and it has a Salisbury rear axle. Reading this interesting thread and following through to investigate further, I see that the Ashcroft ATB isn't available for this type of axle. Have you changed yours or was it always something different (Rover)? For Salisbury axles is the only way, to go for a different brand of ATB and pay the additional money? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 19 minutes ago, Peaklander said: Hope you don't mind a numpty question @BogMonster, I have a 110 TDi and it has a Salisbury rear axle. Reading this interesting thread and following through to investigate further, I see that the Ashcroft ATB isn't available for this type of axle. Have you changed yours or was it always something different (Rover)? For Salisbury axles is the only way, to go for a different brand of ATB and pay the additional money? Bogmonster’s 110s are both the later type axle. His earlier one is a RoW spec one so late Td5 but with a tdi instead. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Poore Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Peaklander said: Hope you don't mind a numpty question @BogMonster, I have a 110 TDi and it has a Salisbury rear axle. Reading this interesting thread and following through to investigate further, I see that the Ashcroft ATB isn't available for this type of axle. Have you changed yours or was it always something different (Rover)? For Salisbury axles is the only way, to go for a different brand of ATB and pay the additional money? If you wanted an ATB in yours then it's probably easier to source a second hand axle off a Td5 or Tdci Defender which has the short nose diff in it then you can drop an Ashcroft ATB in there. I picked up an axle casing complete with hubs and discs for £100 and Nige (@Hybrid_from_Hell) sourced a donor diff for me and then built it up (although I went pegged Ashlocker rather than ATB). Probably worth pricing up the different options, I suspect using a new axle wouldn't be that expensive compared to finding an ATB for the Salisbury. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peaklander Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 Ok understand now thanks. I should have looked at the ROW spec. The later axles just bolt-up then but with a longer prop. Are the TD5 and Tdci all the same so it doesn’t matter the exact age? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 An interesting and helpful thread, thanks everyone. I had thought anything Ashcroft wouldn't work in my 1987 110 but now it looks like the front, at least, could have an ATB if I get 24-23 half shafts. I did actually blow a CV recently but it wasn't the axle end, it was the ball cage that broke (let's pretend that was because of its dubious military history and not my sieve of a memory in the lubrication department...). Shame about the Salisbury at the back end but there are a couple of other options to consider there (ARB and Detroit). Not that I have buckets of money lying around anyway. Just a little aside: I was told, years ago, by a couple of Land Rover anoraks that one of the reasons 10 spline shafts broke fairly easily was that the machining at the spline ends was unusually abrupt, creating a point of shear, rather than tapering off gently. It's true that all the snapped shafts I have seen broke exactly at the point where the splines start and I have seen a scary number of shafts twisted at that point. That being the case, the radiused-down Disco shaft may not be that weak? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 That’s an interesting thought Deep .... 🤔 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Poore Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 26 minutes ago, Peaklander said: Ok understand now thanks. I should have looked at the ROW spec. The later axles just bolt-up then but with a longer prop. Are the TD5 and Tdci all the same so it doesn’t matter the exact age? They do just bolt up but if you transfer calipers from the Salisbury (as I did) then the discs themselves are different (SDB100980L I think is the part number). The Td5 / Tdci axle have the same bolt pattern for the calipers but they've got a slightly different offset on the axles which mean the standard Salisbury disc clashes with the caliper. So in summary swap the axle, change discs, change prop I can't remember what length is required or a part number, I simply phoned Gwyn (Gwyn Lewis 4x4) and told him what I'd done and he bunged the correct length prop in the post for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 I'm curious. Are there options for the Salisbury axle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Poore Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 Don't know ATB side of things, Nige is probably best to weigh in but on the locker front he convinced me that swapping axles was a better choice. The main strength of the Salisbury diff is in the cross pin which you throw away with any conversion, ergo you don't have the main benefit anymore. The casing may be a bit stronger but is also a lot bigger and plough like. Then it came down to (for me) the locker and the various options were either rocking horse poo availability, had design faults, spares issues, or just downright expensive. The Ashcroft offering at the time hadn't been broken, was readily available and not too bad on price. My suspicion is that any ATB Salisbury component / diff is likely to have the same issues. So unless you're really wedded to keeping the axle a Salisbury then there are likely better and more cost effective options (based off very little research for ATBs). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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