Maverik Posted May 25, 2022 Author Share Posted May 25, 2022 1 hour ago, Bowie69 said: Eeek, no, nor would I be. Time for a trip to LR, if they still make them. Just shy of 200 squid to get a genuine from LR. - I was lucky enough to find the FIP pulley on ebay for 50. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted May 25, 2022 Share Posted May 25, 2022 Turners have a good reputation for only selling quality parts, it would indeed be a shame if they have turned back on this. I would have similar concerns about using that pulley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted May 26, 2022 Share Posted May 26, 2022 It really would, but they can only sell what is produced. It’s a pity they don’t have the poorer quality stuff dressed, since they have the equipment to do it. They’d have to increase the price, but anyone using their services is already more concerned with quality than price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger110 Posted May 26, 2022 Share Posted May 26, 2022 On my 1st engine rebuild all the parts were ordered from Turners including the water pump which turned out to be faulty. The mating face which meets the block wasn’t flat and caused oil to leak. After putting the the original pump back on, the problem was solved and the one from Turners ended up in the bin. I wouldn’t buy ancillaries from them anymore, but gaskets etc are all Elring and good quality. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 28, 2022 Author Share Posted May 28, 2022 Sooo, a tedious morning ensued. Timing chest cover on, crank damper on and torqued tight, start engine and it starts screaming. - not expected. So I take the cover back off, reinstall and torque up the damper again and run the engine... silent... Que the head scratching moment... Inspected the cover crank dust seal, looks like new - corteco lip seal, so I popped it out and put in a carp britpart thing that came with the gasket kit I had. Put it all back together and it's silent once again... I can't seem to post up the video of the noise but I can't get my head around how how a simple lip seal can make so much noise, and for no apparent reason. I can't say I'm all that confident this has solved the problem... time will tell. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted May 28, 2022 Share Posted May 28, 2022 Seems like a step forward though to narrowing down the source of the noise, but I don't understand how this could damage the belt. Could it be that the noise is another issue and perhaps a bit of a red herring? I hope not though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smallfry Posted May 28, 2022 Share Posted May 28, 2022 Did you grease the seal between the lips ? As there is no oil behind it to lubricate it it needs some grease. I always use synthetic grease for this, as it doesnt dry out. I cant remember now, but dont you have to put the seal the wrong way round to keep stuff out, or is it a double sided thing ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted May 28, 2022 Share Posted May 28, 2022 Just a thought but is the front cover flat & not bowed inwards, not sure if you have checked it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 29, 2022 Author Share Posted May 29, 2022 50 miles test drive and the noise is back. This time I can see that the timing belt hasn't moved from the position I set it yesterday, so I can finally rule that out as being the issue. I'm starting to get a dreaded feeling it's a engine thrust bearing or main bearing issue I'm hearing... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted May 29, 2022 Share Posted May 29, 2022 Main bearings rumble Crank thrust unlikely to make a noise . Are you absolutely sure it's not any of the ancillary stuff ? Vac pump , alt., water pump or PAS pump Have you had it running with the noise and stationary with an assistant pressing and releasing the clutch while you watch the crank pulley to see if it's moving with thrust ? Does the noise sound the same as all previous times ? Have you used a stethoscope to pinpoint area? Is the noise there all the way through the rev range ? Very puzzling indeed . Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 29, 2022 Author Share Posted May 29, 2022 3 minutes ago, steve b said: Main bearings rumble Crank thrust unlikely to make a noise . Are you absolutely sure it's not any of the ancillary stuff ? Vac pump , alt., water pump or PAS pump Have you had it running with the noise and stationary with an assistant pressing and releasing the clutch while you watch the crank pulley to see if it's moving with thrust ? Does the noise sound the same as all previous times ? Have you used a stethoscope to pinpoint area? Is the noise there all the way through the rev range ? Very puzzling indeed . Steve Yes 100%, not ancillary. Yes, there is little to no end float on the crank, you can't see it move with the clutch pedal depressed, but you can manually shift it holding onto the damper and push pulling it. Yes noise does sound the same. With engine hot after driving it was really noisy at idle, turn engine off, restart no noise initially but then you hear it develop, if you very lightly engage the clutch e.g. so the release bearing is just touching the clutch plate (so not fully engaged) you hear the tone of the noise change. No stethoscope. I was under it yesterday when it was noisy and the sound is coming from the front sump area, you hear the oil pump ticking and its to the front of that. I think the noise is there all the time but when revved the engine noise covers the squeal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted May 29, 2022 Share Posted May 29, 2022 Ok , just refreshing my memory on it . Looks like an internal search starting with the thrust bearings has to be next . What a pain after all your work on it . Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted May 29, 2022 Share Posted May 29, 2022 Quote Yes, there is little to no end float on the crank, you can't see it move with the clutch pedal depressed, but you can manually shift it holding onto the damper and push pulling it. Crank end float according to workshop manual is 0.05mm to 0.15mm I reckon as you can move it by hand fore & aft the end float is out of limits & allowing the crank to move even though is not visible to mark one eyeball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 29, 2022 Author Share Posted May 29, 2022 If only this chap closed this out... Huh, wrong end he's talking about his clutch release bearing by the nd if it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted May 29, 2022 Share Posted May 29, 2022 Yep, clutch release bearig in that thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted May 29, 2022 Share Posted May 29, 2022 Oil pump? Have had a really noisy Britpart pump before I knew better, in a 2.25. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 29, 2022 Author Share Posted May 29, 2022 29 minutes ago, Bowie69 said: Oil pump? Have had a really noisy Britpart pump before I knew better, in a 2.25. Didn't sound like that area, I rebuilt the pump I had with new gears in November. Can't see how it would link to the clutch influencing the sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 29, 2022 Author Share Posted May 29, 2022 I wonder what I can see if I drop the sump, stupid ladder frame in the way. I've actually had an off the wall idea, I might just rip the stupid thing out and put in a 300. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted May 29, 2022 Share Posted May 29, 2022 There are holes in the ladder frame if you remove the oil pump, No3 main could be inspected.,my engine photo attached during its rebuild. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted May 29, 2022 Share Posted May 29, 2022 3 hours ago, western said: Crank end float according to workshop manual is 0.05mm to 0.15mm I reckon as you can move it by hand fore & aft the end float is out of limits & allowing the crank to move even though is not visible to mark one eyeball. I was thinking the same thing - if you can feel it it must be too much? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted May 30, 2022 Share Posted May 30, 2022 I think it’s the thrust bushes too. With that much motion, they may have worn through the soft metals to the steel backing and that is what is causing the squeal, like when brake pads are worn through. You’ll need to remove the ladder frame to get to the middle bearing cap to check the bushes and also the thrust faces of the crank shaft for wear or damage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 30, 2022 Author Share Posted May 30, 2022 I had some feedback from Richard Turner this morning, he mentioned dry crank seals, he said you wouldnt hear worn thrust bearings like that - you just get a lot of end float. I'll be borrwoing a dial guage to check the end float. Next plan will be to remove the timing chest fully, see if there's anything obvious, then I'll drop the sump see if there's anything amiss in there. Deep sigh, this isnt going to happen quickly now, I've pretty much run out of steam, luckily managed to get a car from work which has taken the pressure off. How nice would it be to re-power with a super efficient quiet petrol engine... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted May 30, 2022 Share Posted May 30, 2022 What about getting a second hand 200tdi block, rebuilding it and then take you tdi out and swap the bits across. Then you'll know everything is good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 30, 2022 Author Share Posted May 30, 2022 I've still got the original S suffix block, as I had a spare disco unit that's the one that got sent to Turner's, they kept it and sent me an off the shelf unit. If I'm rebuilding another block I might as well just dismantle the one I've got till I find the problem, most cost/time effective solution just now. Swapping a block is not exactly difficult but it's time intensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted May 30, 2022 Share Posted May 30, 2022 Agreed . End float reading with a DTI first then go from there . Was there any grinding done to the crank when you built this one ? Particularly the thrust faces on the crank ? Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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