Hybrid_From_Hell Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 Hi All, I am becoming more and more concerned that the new 5.2JED V8 is going to do havoc and hell to my gearbox esp, and prob my drivetrain. I know I can soften the shock loads and forces on the drive train via an autobox, and as I have a LT85 these are regarded as the strongest box avaialable in manual format (inc R380) with the exception of a Neanderthal LT95 which I aint fitting So, autobox wise the ZF4 speed RR box is one option, but I have thoughts that it is "Deliacte" I know Mr Ashcroft can work some magic to beef these up but still prob not that strong ? 727 3spd torqueflight etc would be good, but horrible - so I'm considering options. After a conversation with a forumeer the Jaguar HP24 Autobox seemed to surface as being Kin Strong and cheap, thoughts ? And what is involved in fitting one between a V8 bellhousing and a LT230 ? Do the members think a rebuilt (it was 6 months ago) LT230 in good nick with a KAM Forged 4 pn crossshaft in the centre diff will be enough to cope with the engine ? Any other ideas or thoughts ? ON the HP24 Jag auto, does tghis need a Compushift computer ? or is it manual cable, are the change points changable / in the rights places ? Lastly - a P38 1996 RR I know of has a new factory unit zf box, which is this and is it computered, is it any good as a autobox re all of the above Loads of Qs, but slush boxes are a area I am hugely unknowledgeable on ?? HELP Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkrentfitter Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 surely john eales would be the man to ask,as a lot of his hi speck v8,s have been fitted to rally raid trucks inc bowlers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirkthe1 Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 what about a mog autobox?? big bit and i seem to recall they have transfer box built in-could be wrong. But i would imagine that could take some punishment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted August 20, 2010 Author Share Posted August 20, 2010 surely john eales would be the man to ask,as a lot of his hi speck v8,s have been fitted to rally raid trucks inc bowlers. Yes, very logical - and have done "Quaffie 6 speed straight cut sequential - with few mods" - Don't even think about it - Hence the post Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jericho Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 Do the members think a rebuilt (it was 6 months ago) LT230 in good nick with a KAM Forged 4 pn crossshaft in the centre diff will be enough to cope with the engine ? Apparently Atlas tested the lt230 in comparison to their own transfer boxes,and concluded that,with the difflock engaged,it was good for around 1000hp. (this came from Andy Chaplin) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landmannnn Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 From my limited knowledge the ZFHP24 is a bigger and stronger electronic version of the ZFHP22. Pulling one off a jag or bmw won't work since ZF made a number of variations to suit different applications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtail4x4 Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 Hmm I have a jag ZFHP24 autobox here, that I bought for a project that has changed direction, could be yours? it stands me at £75, could bring to Stoneleigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 Apparently Atlas tested the lt230 in comparison to their own transfer boxes,and concluded that,with the difflock engaged,it was good for around 1000hp. (this came from Andy Chaplin) We've tested the LT230 with ~450hp and a Jez behind the wheel and it seems to cope OK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted August 20, 2010 Author Share Posted August 20, 2010 Pulling one off a jag or bmw won't work since ZF made a number of variations to suit different applications. Why ? please explain ? And I too think the LT230 will be OK for it So options are for between V* and Lt230, maybe a V8 bellhousing off something nmodded But - what ? JAg seems to be top poss at the mo, need a Jag expert / user to comment ? Nige Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 Why ? please explain ? At a guess but in no particular order: - Different input shafts / TC's / bellhousings - Different shift patterns / valving - Electronic control of varying complexity - Different output arrangement (not many jags with a transfer box) Also does anyone have any real data on how much stronger 4HP24's are, as in from ZF not a bloke down the pub. I know Jags have some engines with more HP (supercharged 3.6/4.2?) but from previous research into engine alternatives there's not many lumps out there outside of big 4x4's (TLC, Patrol, etc.) that are making the same torque at low RPM's, even lumps pushing more than double the BHP of a 4.6 Rover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landmannnn Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 Why ? please explain ? "wouldn't work" was probably a poor choice of words. You will need a zf from a rr for the bellhousing and output to go with the jag box. Of course a compushift for the electronics and some way of reading the electronic speedo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saley Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 Hi Nigel What I have done in the past for myself and done Twiggys box aswell 1 rr/disco zfhp22, 1 jag zfhp24, strip both and rebuild rr/disco box with jag internals. Twiggy must have a few horses more than most with his 4.6 V7 and his stands up well been in at least 2 years without a problem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hiatt Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 There are couple of safari boys running the Jag box behind a Rover, both done by Roland Marlow ACR Couple of others running them behind supercharged Jag engines. The paddle shift seems to work quite well too. I would try keeping the LT85 and perhaps a few evening classes in mechanical sympathy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkrentfitter Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 Yes, very logical - and have done "Quaffie 6 speed straight cut sequential - with few mods" - Don't even think about it - Hence the post Nige there is another race and rally box builder in harlow,can,t remember the name,they were at the rally show at chatsworth this year,speak to milner offroad,they use a lexus autobox with i think a hilux transfer box in the milner protruck,having seen those launch off the start line they are pretty impressive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtydiesel Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 Nige, About the best bolt in solution would be a hp22/24 hybrid box. You would need a a p38 v8 hp24 and a rr classic v8 hp22 Use the belhousing torque convertor and oil pump of the "24" bolted to the main gearbox casing off the "22" you then need the main rotating assembly and clutch packs out of the 24 the with the valve body and govenor out of the "22", There are a few pipes that need tweeking to get the manual valve body to clear the larger clutch packs but nothing too major. Even then you are going to be on it's limits. We had a eales 5.2 on a home built box as above, followed by an ashcroft monsterbox, even on redline fluid with a 24x12 cooler they still got a bit warm and both eventually died. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hiatt Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 speak to milner offroad,they use a lexus autobox with i think a hilux transfer box in the milner protruck,having seen those launch off the start line they are pretty impressive. As far as I know there are no auto Milner Protrucks. The early ones had Tremec T5 boxes but most, if not all, were changed to Drenth sequentials. Most of the newer R5 Protrucks have a Milner designed transaxle and no transfer box. Either set up would cost you well over £10k, nearer £20k for the transaxle and bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkrentfitter Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 As far as I know there are no auto Milner Protrucks. The early ones had Tremec T5 boxes but most, if not all, were changed to Drenth sequentials. Most of the newer R5 Protrucks have a Milner designed transaxle and no transfer box. Either set up would cost you well over £10k, nearer £20k for the transaxle and bits. i stand corrected,i have seen a racer with a lexus autobox with the hilux transfer box,that was behind a breathed on lexus v8 motor,no option is going to be cheap as modifying autoboxes requires some prior knowledge,i have stripped and repaired clarke auto transmissions in container handling machines,which by contrast are quite simple,but i would hesitate before attempting a hybrid 22/24 build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6 pot Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 Hi You could try http://www.rakeway.co.uk/index.htm I have no connection with them but they have been very helpful when i have talked to them Cheers Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted August 21, 2010 Author Share Posted August 21, 2010 Hi You could try http://www.rakeway.co.uk/index.htm I have no connection with them but they have been very helpful when i have talked to them Cheers Rob I know Neil well, but I would rather not have my wallet on 'speaking terms' with his loverley kit - ta awfully Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLineMike Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 seems a bit late for that nige since i would presume JE know your pin number :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bush65 Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 When Land Rover was assembling 110's in Aus, they used Isuzu diesels and LT95's. After 85, they dropped the LT95 for LT85's in the civilian versions (army continued to specify LT95). That engine spits the thrust bearings out of stock LT95 transfer cases and the only way to get good life from them is to fit the taper roller bearing kit produced for the army. The stock LT85 doesn't last behind the Isuzu, so Maxi-drive came up with a larger taper roller bearing conversion for the input shaft. The late R380's last if treated with care so seem about as strong as an LT85. The Isuzu kills 4HP22 ZF's in no time at all. A beefed up 4HP24 may be ok if treated with care. Personally I would be looking at a GM auto - by the time you beefed up the pi$$y ZF, you could have a stronger transmission for less. Don't forget to allow a lot of $$$ for an over large transmission cooler system in the back for whatever auto tranny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zardos Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 Nige, About the best bolt in solution would be a hp22/24 hybrid box. You would need a a p38 v8 hp24 and a rr classic v8 hp22 Use the belhousing torque convertor and oil pump of the "24" bolted to the main gearbox casing off the "22" you then need the main rotating assembly and clutch packs out of the 24 the with the valve body and govenor out of the "22", There are a few pipes that need tweeking to get the manual valve body to clear the larger clutch packs but nothing too major. Even then you are going to be on it's limits. We had a eales 5.2 on a home built box as above, followed by an ashcroft monsterbox, even on redline fluid with a 24x12 cooler they still got a bit warm and both eventually died. I know somebody who has just had to have a new clutch pack and torque converter in a hp22/24 hybrid box and it was connected to a 2.8 tgv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 I spoke to a dutch guy once who ran a diesel v8 6.2 with an lt 85. this got noisy very soon, and then was rebuilt using needle bearings in a few places, rather than ball bearings. From what I understood, thins were fine from then on. Not sure what other weak points there are with the lt 85, but an option to consider? Daan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 Drive the LT85 until it goes bang in true Nige fashion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon White Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 Why not use a TH350 and adaptor to bolt it to the LT230? If not then TF sounds the best bits. BW's are a pain to rebuild yourslef and theres sod all aftermarket parts available for them. The american boxes on the other hand parts are cheap as chips and theres loads of aftermarket uprated bits available for them. Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.