JeffR Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Ok so here we go. Been trying to get shot of a steering shimmy on the Disco and have replaced and adjusted the following (lots replaced cos were well and truly cattle trucked): Completely re-bushed, all bolt holes are round and not worn New shock n springs Recon steering box and new drop arm New steering damper all new tre's Tracking re-done Toe in/out re-done Swivel hub pre-loads well within tolerances Tyres /wheels could possibly be out of balance Steering column u/j done Prop u/js redone Wheel bearings show no play What is there left? I've moved the vibration (steering wheel "shuffles from side to side) to 60ish mph from 45-50ish, it's a vast improvement, but still not right, and quite frankly, I'm buggered if I can work out why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pat_pending Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 "Tyres /wheels could possibly be out of balance" That would have been the first thing I checked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffR Posted June 20, 2014 Author Share Posted June 20, 2014 "Tyres /wheels could possibly be out of balance" That would have been the first thing I checked. had them done last year! Hence the possibly. never had out of balance wheels cause these symptoms, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Funny wear on the tyres? Might be worth popping the rears to the front? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffR Posted June 20, 2014 Author Share Posted June 20, 2014 Funny wear on the tyres? Might be worth popping the rears to the front? Even tried another set of wheels and tyres, bloody shimmy still there. I honestly give in, only thing I can think of is to try and find a tyre place locally that will balance wheels on the car..... This vehicle is about half an hour away from a gallon of petrol and a box of matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Is your steering box in the centre at straight ahead ? And check the wheels/tyres again for balance and run-out , some of the pot holes around here could be more correctly called bomb craters . I'm glad I have 1 tonne/fc steels . Tyres do deform too so a high spot could well be the problem cheers Steveb posted while I was chugging around the keyboard , I'd pull another thin shim or two from the king pins and maybe try another damper , new stuff does sometimes fail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffR Posted June 20, 2014 Author Share Posted June 20, 2014 Steering box definitely centralised (used 8mm drill), has to be the bloody tyres. Bomb craters?, here in Northumberland we test drive super tankers in the small oceans they call pot holes...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honitonhobbit Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 You have roads that far north! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPendrey Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 "Steering shimmy"? How does it manifest itself? At certain speeds, or constant, when road is bumpy, smooth, both? I'm interested because I have an issue with one set of tyres/wheels that the car get unsettled at >55 mph if I drive over bumps (drains for example), but then on another set of tyres the car is smooth. Obviously, in my case it is related to the wheels or tyres. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco-Ron Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Might sound daft, but have you looked at the rear axle bushes??.... worn radius arm bushes often show symptoms at the front! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigelw Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Anti-roll bar links??? Or is yours pre-historic like mine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De Ranged Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Could you explain "shimmy" for me.... is it a pulsing in the steering wheel, or is it a wonder in the tracking (you have to keep adjusting the wheel to keep it straight), is there any noise that accompanies it (an increase in road noise or a droning), if there is a noise can you change its tone by speeding up slowing down Oh and a side note how do you center a steering box with a drill? I do it by removing the pitman arm, turn the steering wheel lock to lock counting revolutions then turn the wheel to the middle of this count, with the wheels pointing ahead line up the pitman while it is attatched to the steering linkages (if the pitman is off parallel adjust drag link, fit the pitman back to the box (if it is high pointing on the spline bias it towards the center of the road ie I'm RHD so I bias to the right, this counters road camber) After all that check the steering wheel if it isn't center pull it and refit it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffR Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 Might sound daft, but have you looked at the rear axle bushes??.... worn radius arm bushes often show symptoms at the front! Changed all suspension bushes , front and rear "Steering shimmy"? How does it manifest itself? At certain speeds, or constant, when road is bumpy, smooth, both? I'm interested because I have an issue with one set of tyres/wheels that the car get unsettled at >55 mph if I drive over bumps (drains for example), but then on another set of tyres the car is smooth. Obviously, in my case it is related to the wheels or tyres. Wheel pulses left to right and vice versa Anti-roll bar links??? Or is yours pre-historic like mine No anti roll bars Could you explain "shimmy" for me.... is it a pulsing in the steering wheel, or is it a wonder in the tracking (you have to keep adjusting the wheel to keep it straight), is there any noise that accompanies it (an increase in road noise or a droning), if there is a noise can you change its tone by speeding up slowing down Oh and a side note how do you center a steering box with a drill? I do it by removing the pitman arm, turn the steering wheel lock to lock counting revolutions then turn the wheel to the middle of this count, with the wheels pointing ahead line up the pitman while it is attatched to the steering linkages (if the pitman is off parallel adjust drag link, fit the pitman back to the box (if it is high pointing on the spline bias it towards the center of the road ie I'm RHD so I bias to the right, this counters road camber) After all that check the steering wheel if it isn't center pull it and refit it Definite pulsing left and right, box centralised as you described, but using a drill bit in the slot at the back of drop arm and the corresponding hole in the steering box - still gotta pull the steering wheel off to get it central on the spines. I have come to the conclusion (having just crawled out from underneath the bar steward, and having fed every blood feeding insect in Northumberland that is has to be a tyre issue , there is simply nowt else it could be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballcock Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 You could try some tyre beads they seem to get good reviews, Although I haven't tried them myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheffield Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 The two cases I have known of this sort of problem have both been tyres. Once out of balance, and the other just cheap tyres that had to be replaced to cure the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Hancock Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Although the tyres have been balanced are they running true? buckled rims or out of shape tyres come to mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffR Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 Just got back from the local tyre place, tracking is spot on so is toe in. Tyres are round and balanced and, according to my DTI have about 3 thou run out and yes the fckin shimmy is still there, sod it If I don't go above 60, it's not a problem, above 60 you can see the bonnet vibrate, I wonder......... Could worn CV joints cause vibration rather than their usual "ticking", I mean the buggers are probably the original ones and have done 222111 miles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Hancock Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Try increasing the swivel preload, not too far that the steering wont self centre. Just a thought but have you got roller top swivel or railco? railco have IIRC a higher preload figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tacr2man Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 have you got a mass balancer bolted onto diff ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbekko Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Pinion/diff bearings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 I have a similar problem except mine is distance dependant. It goes and comes with distance travelled. I think its tyres on mine. I'm running BFGs and both sets I've had do the same. I now have a constant wobble due to wheel balance but this now increases with the distance wobble (1 +1 = 2). If I get the wheels balanced again the constant wobble goes and the distance one is still there. Never found out what does it and I've had it for about 60,000 miles and two sets of crappy BFGs which are a barstool to balance and they all have massive hop which can't be balanced out. I think the hop in the wheels synchronises based on corners and stuff and so you get distance dependant wobble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffR Posted June 22, 2014 Author Share Posted June 22, 2014 have you got a mass balancer bolted onto diff ? I was wondering about that, there's one on, but how do you tell if it;s defective? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco-Ron Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Try removing it, I never found they do anything....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffR Posted June 22, 2014 Author Share Posted June 22, 2014 Went back to place that did the tracking check and we had another go, took everything off - tracking arm and drag link, checked and reset, put back on and went for a drive, apart from pulling very slightly to the left, the bad vibes are virtually gone. We think tyre wear is the cause of pulling to the left - you wanna see how much lead it took to almost (ran out of space on the rim!) balance a pair of Insa turbos........ But as the guy said, all the settings are the same as before, toe in set at zero etc yet this time it's not far off perfect, there is a tiny bit of vibration at 65-80mph, but it's only just noticeable, so he's as stumped as I was...... At least the bugger is drivable again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 What type of tyres are they Jeff, and what size? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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