No more Land Rover…?

[Jamie_grieve]

Copied from the times:

Jaguar Land Rover is to drop the 75-year-old “Land Rover” brand in a reboot of the automotive giant, which will also include a relaunch of Jaguar as an electric marque whose models will start at £100,000 a time.

The group’s first all-electric Range Rover, built in Solihull in the West Midlands, will also launch in 2024 as the company doubles its investment plans to £15 billion over the next five years as part of a strategy of to end all internal combustion engine models by 2036.

 

Interesting development.

[miketomcat]

They really have lost there way. It's a shame that they're determined to lose any heritage they had left.

On the bright side they can't really sue all the land rover clubs and specialist for using the land rover name any more.

Mike

[Anderzander]

Blimey ! 

[elbekko]

Again?

From the horse's mouth:

https://media.jaguarlandrover.com/news/2023/04/jlr-invest-ps15-billion-over-next-five-years-its-modern-luxury-electric-first-future

Edited April 20, 2023 by elbekko

[Bowie69]

Bit baffling if I am honest. 

[smallfry]

Wonder what they will call the new(er) Defender then ? I guess the vast majority of new generation of buyers know not much at all of the heritage and history, and don't care about it.

Jaguar = Spivs and bank robbers cars, unreliable, rusty and don't last well ? The marques great days are long over.

The Land Rover name, legend, and history will live on though, like all the other great marques that have ceased to be.

[L19MUD]

It is this bit that blows my mind 'Land Rover will become a trust mark'

 

I can see the point about people saying they drive a Range Rover to some extent but that is not the case with Discovery or Defender in my view. Really feels like a very bad move to me. I wonder if they are going to drop the Land Rover logo/badges on the cars?!

 

[Anderzander]

You can see from that that they will partition them - Discovery and Defender will be separate brands, either in bolt on show rooms like BMW and Minis or some cheaper partitioning method.

[Maverik]

By the sound of it the Jaguar part is being torn apart too.

 

Iconic British Land Rover brand to be dropped after 75 years as Jaguar goes all electric (bmmagazine.co.uk)

[L19MUD]

28 minutes ago, Anderzander said:

You can see from that that they will partition them - Discovery and Defender will be separate brands, either in bolt on show rooms like BMW and Minis or some cheaper partitioning method.

This all stems from the 'pillars' they used to talk about and which models fell under each one

[Gazzar]

The last Landrover was made in the early 1980's. Everything else is something else. 

[L19MUD]

4 minutes ago, Gazzar said:

The last Landrover was made in the early 1980's. Everything else is something else. 

Before they moved to those new fangled coil spring things 🙂

 

[Gazzar]

Yes.... That didn't last long, did it?

Moved on to the next trendy thing within a couple of decades....

I wonder how long they'll stick with rubber sacks before they move on to something even more expensive, electrically dependent and unreliable.

[ThreePointFive]

2 hours ago, smallfry said:

Wonder what they will call the new(er) Defender then ? I guess the vast majority of new generation of buyers know not much at all of the heritage and history, and don't care about it.

Jaguar = Spivs and bank robbers cars, unreliable, rusty and don't last well ? The marques great days are long over.

The Land Rover name, legend, and history will live on though, like all the other great marques that have ceased to be.

This is one of the few times I'm going to (partially) disagree with you.

I'm probably more "into" Jags than I am LR, especially with the recent tribulations of my 90, I just like to keep things separate. In fact, this is my first time without a Jag in over 10 years.

This forum/culture is completely at odds with the Jag one, which may lead to the impression it's just another car brand unless you look into it. I can assure you is just as big as the LR following and just as passionate. The owners do have a different mindset entirely to maintenance and the like, which I don't always agree with.

Jag has a lot of history and has achieved some truly amazing things for what resources the company has historically had to work with. The Tata investment was a leap forward and led to it's best products yet, but disinterest/confusion from management and a market that moved away entirely from the large, powerful saloons that Jag's brand revolves around has led to stagnation in the last few years.

My money was on Jag being shelved as a brand that is no longer producing the models the current trend is after (the F Pace and I Pace aside).

Land Rover seems like exactly the direction things are heading and hybridisation/electrification would have future proofed it. It is a brand synonymous with the type of product it's creating, in the same way everything's a Jeep and anything that sucks is a Hoover. Or also a Jeep ...

I am very surprised they've gone this way, but then I know nothing about the industry. Along with the need to refer to models without putting "the" in front of it.

[landroversforever]

It will be a sad day when the name is dropped. But all the mention of Jaguar is probably the most confusing bit for me. From the various podcasts etc I listen to, it seemed almost inevitable that Jaguar was going.

[Bowie69]

100K starting price on Jaguar, also baffling.

Will cars be only for the very, very rich?

[Gazzar]

Sadly we are in a world of increasing wealth inequality. These eras usually end with turmoil, but I remain optimistic/deluded that we've grown and can all see the benefit of better distribution of spending power. 

[Bowie69]

Citroen Ami for all....

 

[Nonimouse]

After 75 years of unreliability and customer product testing, it's sad, but about as expected as a thing we all know about. JLR is a low volume manufacturer who's intrinsic component companies have survived on it's past for longer than I've been around.

I'm quite please that my own favourite vehicles and my own past will no longer be associated with the JLR brand

[ThreePointFive]

3 hours ago, Bowie69 said:

100K starting price on Jaguar, also baffling.

Will cars be only for the very, very rich?

I've felt that way about cars for a while now. It seems impossible to buy and own your vehicle from new, the best most of us can do is get something 5+ years old without the bank owning it for you.

I know a lot of people are quite happy living this way if it means they can drive a symbol of how well they're doing. The irony that they can't actually afford it seems lost though.

I look forward to the traditional Jaguar depreciation making any future cars infinitely affordable after only a few weeks.

[Bowie69]

But in 10 years will any have a functioning battery?

[Anderzander]

I’m quite pleased in a way.

[smallfry]

7 hours ago, ThreePointFive said:

This is one of the few times I'm going to (partially) disagree with you.

I'm probably more "into" Jags than I am LR, especially with the recent tribulations of my 90, I just like to keep things separate. In fact, this is my first time without a Jag in over 10 years.

This forum/culture is completely at odds with the Jag one, which may lead to the impression it's just another car brand unless you look into it. I can assure you is just as big as the LR following and just as passionate. The owners do have a different mindset entirely to maintenance and the like, which I don't always agree with.

Jag has a lot of history and has achieved some truly amazing things for what resources the company has historically had to work with. The Tata investment was a leap forward and led to it's best products yet, but disinterest/confusion from management and a market that moved away entirely from the large, powerful saloons that Jag's brand revolves around has led to stagnation in the last few years.

My money was on Jag being shelved as a brand that is no longer producing the models the current trend is after (the F Pace and I Pace aside).

Land Rover seems like exactly the direction things are heading and hybridisation/electrification would have future proofed it. It is a brand synonymous with the type of product it's creating, in the same way everything's a Jeep and anything that sucks is a Hoover. Or also a Jeep ...

I am very surprised they've gone this way, but then I know nothing about the industry. Along with the need to refer to models without putting "the" in front of it.

I'm sure we can disagree about a few more things than this !

Seriously though, referring to them as a "Jag" is exactly what a spiv or bank robber would do, its a Jaguar, don't you know ! This is what I was told by an old boy back when I was 19, and bought an XJ6 4.2  SWB series 1.  This was 1979, and the car was 1972. It cost £750 at seven years old. When I bought it, I was told by all and sundry how unreliable it would be. It wasn't. Nothing ever went wrong with it in the two years I had it. About six months later, I was offered a XJ12 series 1, also 1972, and also SWB (I always thought they looked better) that didn't run properly, for £600. It was on Stromberg carburettors, and the fault was a couple of split diaphragms, which apparently a garage could not find ! Lovely car, but I could not afford to run it @ 10mpg. Both of these were getting rusty though. Ironically, the reliability was one of the reasons I sold it. Nothing to do or work on, so I got bored with it. Also I was developing the Land Rover sickness..............

Later I bought a S type, which was very rusty at 12 years old and an MOT failure because of it. I bought it specifically for the rear axle assy, for a custom project. So you see, I too have a little history with them ! Although I never had another, for me, it all seemed to change and become more modern and characterless after the XJ series 3. I guess I just like old stuff !

I know they have a great following, but what did you mean by owners having a different mindset ? Not DIY I guess ? I have read a lot about modifications to the older stuff, but I thought this was NOT frowned upon these days, like it once was. 

"Along with the need to refer to models without putting "the" in front of it." This irks me too, same as when you need to see THE doctor. I always make a point of using "The". 

 

 

[landroversforever]

Not sure if you can see this without having an account, but this is from The Intercooler:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CrQlIenIBkR/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
 

seems like the name isn’t actually dying from their quote  

[Anderzander]

When I think of Jaguar being good - it seems to me that their peak was around the D type and E type - the short production XKSS was sublime.

I liked the Mk2’s and Mk9’s - but they were obviously luxury cars compared to the D and E type, and could almost have been made by another company.

Then I liked the XJ coupe’s - like the one Harry Metcalfe has just finished sorting. A nice combination of speed and class. 

After that they didn’t seem to make anything I was interested in. Though most brands I find that way. 

The new XK cars looked to be finding their way again - but I think my interest in new cars had gone by that point.