Vapour 101 camper

[Badger110]

3 hours ago, miketomcat said:

I think for me the idea of a 101 camper is viable and I'm happy I could make it work yes it's not perfect but nothing I've seen is. I like them and the way it could look.

There's the whole crux of it, it's what you like the look of.

They're not the most economical, quiet or efficient means to get what you want, but you like them and the proof is that no fecker is gonna change your mind

[landroversforever]

Different DROPS bed for each job?  

https://www.i-bidder.com/en-gb/auction-catalogues/witham/catalogue-id-witham10112/lot-941aee63-dd9f-4cbd-af15-ac8b00fb91c6

[miketomcat]

1 hour ago, landroversforever said:

Different DROPS bed for each job?  

https://www.i-bidder.com/en-gb/auction-catalogues/witham/catalogue-id-witham10112/lot-941aee63-dd9f-4cbd-af15-ac8b00fb91c6

Not helping!

Much as I would love a truck their size just makes them not viable.

Mike

[Bowie69]

One of these?

[landroversforever]

15 minutes ago, miketomcat said:

Not helping!

Much as I would love a truck their size just makes them not viable.

Mike

There is just something about an 8-legger. I'd take the S26 Scammell if I had the cash and the license!

[Badger110]

We had something like this on one of our bases in Germany, it was used to load aircraft.

 

 

I've always had an idea to convert the rear into a home, then rock up at your chosen spot and up you go...nothing beats a brew in the morning above the tree line

 

[landroversforever]

3 minutes ago, Badger110 said:

We had something like this on one of our bases in Germany, it was used to load aircraft.

 

 

I've always had an idea to convert the rear into a home, then rock up at your chosen spot and up you go...nothing beats a brew in the morning above the tree line

 

Room with a view sir?  

[Badger110]

You just have to remember where you are should you want a pee in the middle of the night

[landroversforever]

5 minutes ago, Badger110 said:

You just have to remember where you are should you want a pee in the middle of the night

See how far you can shoot it  

[miketomcat]

1 hour ago, Badger110 said:

You just have to remember where you are should you want a pee in the middle of the night

Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. 

[FridgeFreezer]

18 hours ago, garrycol said:

• You won't want the V8 so that goes in the bin  - WHY works well and cheap top run on LPG.
• The gearbox/transfer probably goes with it - Why works well once you are familiar with it - high speed gears out out of a RRC works well
• It doesn't have PAS so you need to engineer a conversion - yes I agree but a RRC four bolt PAS box virtually bolts in.
• It has drums all round and the axles, hubs, drums and even wheels are unique to the 101 / FC so a ton of work / money to sort that out  - The drums stop well but 4 disk brake kits are available.  Why do you need to change wheels - all available relatively cheap.
• It's a noisy uninsulated 2-seater with Series seats so loads of work to do there - not as noisy as you think - easy to insulate and Defender seats go straight in.
• It's not long enough so you've got to modify the back end - I guess it depends what you need - as shown in the pics I put up earlier there are various options available.
• They're not even cheap to buy these days, a crusty 130 would be cheaper and the parts are all stock Defender apart from the middle 20" of exhaust pipe and the rear prop.

 

Garry, I know Mike well enough to take a fair guess at all these - if it was me I'd be dropping a 4.6 V8 and EFI in because that's exactly what I did in our 127, but I also know that Mike is very much a 200TDi chap and fuel costs for the long trips he does would have an impact.

However, I also think a TDi would be under-powered and over-stressed in a 101 so not sure what the right answer is - fundamentally it's a 3-ton brick so it's never going to be good.

Keeping an asthmatic de-tuned 3.5 V8 on carbs & points seems like the worst of all worlds even with LPG - and LPG brings issues with ferries/tunnels, not to mention loss of space and difficulty finding it for sale these days.

Good of you to assume I have no idea how noisy or uncomfortable a 101 is, thanks. It's not like I've ever driven a Series long-distance on bad roads or anything and I'm aware of the work you can do to make things more comfortable - but it's extra work and extra cost to even get near the standard level of even the most knackered 7.5 tonner.

 

4 hours ago, landroversforever said:

Different DROPS bed for each job?

I've pondered these trucks, but I honestly reckon the smart money is a civilian 8x4 version, they're 10 a penny, no rare parts, and IIRC they often have lockers in the back axle(s) as they're in and out of building sites / quarries etc. all day anyway.

[miketomcat]

I would live with the V8 for a little while (I've never had a V8) but as fridge says I wouldn't put a 4.6 in the fuel costs would cripple me. Whilst I do like the 200tdi I'm not daft enough to put one in a 101 hell it's marginal in the ibex. I would consider a tgv but they aren't readily available. So it would probably end up with something like Isuzu 3.9, nissan FD 35 or Cummins diesel, coupled to a manual box (I dislike autos). Yes there are several things I would probably end up changing but I'm not very good at leaving things alone. 

Sensible head on and I use the term very loosely, I should get a 130 chassis and build my own. But I'd still end up needing a different engine so I might as well do it in a 101 that's half way there. To be honest this is all subject to finding one at the right price and at the right time.

Mike

 

 

[FridgeFreezer]

The 4.6 in the ambulance manages better MPG than the 3.5 did (and a much easier drive) - but it's still only ~17mpg, although the plus side is that we cruise at (ahem) 70mph unlike the 300TDi Pulse we met in Scotland, he was taller (lifted the roof an extra ~30cm), wider, 800kg heavier and was not having a relaxing driving experience on the mountain passes he was envious of 70kph never mind MPH and I'm not sure how much fuel he was saving, if we drove everywhere at 55mph we may well break 20mpg, it's happened before.

80bhp/ton next to 30bhp/ton   the racing stripe is +5hp too although the bonnet-mounted pickaxe obviously gets bonus rufty-tufty overland points.

I don't know how the pulse compares with a 101 in frontal area / kitted weight, I assume the pulse (this one especially) is a LOT heavier, but maybe not so different to actually push through the air at motorway speeds.

I'd be interested to know what @qwakers gets from his race truck in terms of MPG by way of comparison.

[Bowie69]

Was just going to mention the stripe, Martini?

[qwakers]

11 minutes ago, FridgeFreezer said:

The 4.6 in the ambulance manages better MPG than the 3.5 did (and a much easier drive) - but it's still only ~17mpg, although the plus side is that we cruise at (ahem) 70mph unlike the 300TDi Pulse we met in Scotland, he was taller (lifted the roof an extra ~30cm), wider, 800kg heavier and was not having a relaxing driving experience on the mountain passes he was envious of 70kph never mind MPH and I'm not sure how much fuel he was saving, if we drove everywhere at 55mph we may well break 20mpg, it's happened before.

80bhp/ton next to 30bhp/ton   the racing stripe is +5hp too although the bonnet-mounted pickaxe obviously gets bonus rufty-tufty overland points.

I don't know how the pulse compares with a 101 in frontal area / kitted weight, I assume the pulse (this one especially) is a LOT heavier, but maybe not so different to actually push through the air at motorway speeds.

I'd be interested to know what @qwakers gets from his race truck in terms of MPG by way of comparison.

14mpg if i sit on the limiter on the motorway, 16mpg at 50.

 

22 mpg if you stick to 40 everywhere. not worth it lol. 

[garrycol]

7 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

Good of you to assume I have no idea how noisy or uncomfortable a 101 is, thanks. It's not like I've ever driven a Series long-distance on bad roads or anything and I'm aware of the work you can do to make things more comfortable - but it's extra work and extra cost to even get near the standard level of even the most knackered 7.5 tonner.

Yes we all have our views and they are all valid, it is up to the OP to select what he thinks is appropriate.  By the way the 3.5 in the 101 (unlike the Stage 1) is not detuned, it is the same basic spec as the equivalent RRC of the time.

I did not make any assumptions on your knowledge of the 101 - just expressing my own experiences having driven them over massive distances (compared to UK) a quite a number of times and using one as a camper.  A Series (even a 3) is completely different to a 101 on the road.  A 101 is far more quiet, the ride is far smoother and softer, and the cabin is no where near as hot.  I have been away with a number of series vehicles and taken series passengers, and they all commented how much more comfortable a 101 is compared to a series.  Yes a 200 or 300TDi is not a good fit for a 101.

Cheers

Garry

 

 

 

[garrycol]

5 hours ago, miketomcat said:

Sensible head on and I use the term very loosely, I should get a 130 chassis and build my own. But I'd still end up needing a different engine so I might as well do it in a 101 that's half way there. To be honest this is all subject to finding one at the right price and at the right time.

Mike

 

 

This 101 has had its chassis extended - 125" I think - has a Leyland 4.4 litre V8 out of a car.  If the extension done where the load area is there is minimal body modifications required.

  Various engines work OK - the 4.6 RV8 is good so is the 4.o Isuzu turbo diesel and the 6 cylinder version.  The red camper I posted up before had a Mazda 3.2 diesel - on road performance is about the same as a 3.5 RV8 but only uses about half the fuel.

[miketomcat]

Chassis extension would trigger IVA and if I went to that level I might as well start with a 130 chassis and build from scratch. To be honest at 17 mpg and the difference in price between petrol and diesel 4.6 sounds almost appealing. I'm down to 20-25 mpg when towing and upto 30 mpg solo. At least a 4.6 would be a relatively straightforward swap.

Mike

[elbekko]

Give in to the dark side

[Ed Poore]

I second what everyone's saying and shove a petrol V8 in there . I just crunched some numbers it doesn't work out cheaper than a typical diesel (taking the two figures quoted above 20mpg towing on the Ibex and 17mpg on Jons) then you need a difference of >18p/l between petrol and diesel to break even on fuel costs.

One thing that is often overlooked on the big diesel engine swaps (particularly the 6BT / truck lorry ones) is that they do not like revving hard - yes there are governor springs etc that people swap out but fuel economy falls of a cliff. Fundamentally it is a 5.9l engine which needs more fuel just to keep running and in order to rev harder you need to feed a diesel more fuel. Also for your scenario of long drives you really wouldn't want a 6BT etc,. screaming along for long periods of time. Ideally a 6BT and similar engines (i.e. ex truck engines) like to be cruising at about 1800-1850rpm. Ashcrofts et. al do 1:1 (although I think they've just brought out a 0.9:1 ratio) for the LT230 but on "standard" size tyres (i.e. ~32") the engine is still running quite high. What most of the Cummins crowd do is fit bigger tyres (35"+) to help with the gearing, or potentially change out diffs. When I was considering a 6BT as an option for the 6x6 I largely discounted it in the end because of having to change all the gearing. Fitting >32" tyres isn't an option in my case unless I start chopping things up and seperating the axles because the rear axles are closely coupled.

I do have a mate who has a set of 0.7:1 LT230 gearboxes made up - he's still got a few festering around in his yard and were created for similar purposes (going behind big diesel engines that don't like to rev). That ratio is the highest overdrive you can get away with in an LT230 because there's just no more space with the current gear spacing / shaft sizes to do anything different. The chap who actually cut the gears for him turned out to be the place that cut the gears for the LT230s for Land Rover in the first instance so he knew what he was doing!

What was the point of all that? I guess what I was trying to say was that swapping a petrol V8 for a big diesel might have bigger financial side-effects than you first expect.

[miketomcat]

Isn't the 101 a lt95 and if I remember correctly one piece gear/transfer box so again if a 4.6 bolts straight up It's starting to make a lot of sense. Mind electronics still scare me but I know a man or two......

Mike

[Ed Poore]

1 minute ago, miketomcat said:

Isn't the 101 a lt95 and if I remember correctly one piece gear/transfer box so again if a 4.6 bolts straight up It's starting to make a lot of sense. Mind electronics still scare me but I know a man or two......

Mike

Normally yes - but they have different ratios on the transfer box side of things. I think the 101 is the lowest ratio of the lot. The RRC had the highest drive ratio (~0.9:1 if I remember correctly). I'm fairly sure that's also what the Stage 1s and subseqently my 6x6 had. I think you can swap the gears out - I've not had a look but I've heard that the RRC ratios aren't that commonly available because everyone wants them, but that might be hearsay.

The LT95 was only ever fitted (standard, except some Perentines) with V8s so it's a V8 bell housing which I think a 4.6 will just bolt up to @FridgeFreezer will confirm. I've got a spare LT95 bell housing on the bench if you wanted some measurements.

[landroversforever]

The biggest barrier I think to a 6BT conversion in a 101 is the diff ratios.... aren't they something like 5:1? Or am I remembering incorrectly? 

 

EDIT: 5.4:1 

[Ed Poore]

According to this 5.4:1 but I guess they have taller wheels as standard? Looks to be 9x16s so roughly 34"?

[steve b]

Iirc @Lara who used to be on here a lot had a 101 with a nice engine conversion and 40" tyres ? 

Would the OM606 be an option ? more rpm available and lots of tuning options ...