Vapour 101 camper

[sharkey964]

A good freind of mine has this.

[miketomcat]

I definitely prefer the military 101 or Volvo C303/4/6. The Pinz and forward control just don't do it for me. Just wish I had the time and money to progress this past vapour.

Mike

[Stellaghost]

9 minutes ago, miketomcat said:

 Just wish I had the time and money to progress this past vapour.

Mike

How true, would be neat if money could be made as easy as  time !!!!!

Or we can always find time but you have to look bloody hard to find money Regards Stephen

Edited February 11, 2021 by Stellaghost

[landroversforever]

2 hours ago, Stellaghost said:

 but you have to look bloody hard to find money

My sofa isn't that big  

[garrycol]

13 hours ago, sharkey964 said:

A good freind of mine has this.

Where those shackles are on either side of the number plate are not recovery points and it would be highly dangerous if used as such - they will pull out of the front bumper if used in a horizontal pull of a bogged 101 Ambo.  They are there for a vertical lift by a helicopter and set up for a vertical lift not a horizontal pull.

Garry

[Blanco]

2 hours ago, garrycol said:

Where those shackles are on either side of the number plate are not recovery points

..... interesting, they appear to be offset, suggesting the cog was, ..... 

[landroversforever]

4 hours ago, Blanco said:

..... interesting, they appear to be offset, suggesting the cog was, ..... 

Wonder if it was done to clear the Nokken winch?

[garrycol]

27 minutes ago, landroversforever said:

Wonder if it was done to clear the Nokken winch?

I am not up on the Ambulance but I dont believe they had the winch.  The position of the right hand lift point has been moved a few inches to the right of the correct position which would have been just under the edge of the grill - in a mirror position to the other one.

[landroversforever]

49 minutes ago, garrycol said:

I am not up on the Ambulance but I dont believe they had the winch.  The position of the right hand lift point has been moved a few inches to the right of the correct position which would have been just under the edge of the grill - in a mirror position to the other one.

I thought only the GS were air lifted? Which would have been the ones with a winch sometimes. 

[garrycol]

Maybe you are correct - as I said I am not up on the ambulance - but those points are the lift points - there are ones also inside the cabin.  All 101s started as the air portable GS variant with some of these being later converted into ambulances and Radio Bodies.  So some of the air portable stuff may have still been on the vehicles.  The brackets are just bolted through the bumpers and even in Aust rust out - I would be happy to use them for an onroad recovery or tow but not for snatching or a heavy recovery.

The winch had nothing to do with being air portable - in the UK inventory it is fitted to some of the Rapier group vehicles.  It was fitted to all Australian 101s - works well but does need a working engine so an electric winch in my view is a better option.

[landroversforever]

Oh I know they all started as GS variants. I wasn’t meaning that winch was anything to do with being air-portable, just that I’ve only ever seen them on the GS version. (Not sure if the Vampires had them or not). 

[Snagger]

Hopefully they reinforced those recovery points, then.

[greenmeanie]

This is an interesting topic which I have been through recently with a brother who fancied an old military vehicle as the base for a camper build for his wife and two dogs. Some comments from his investigations:

1. The Volvo 6X6 is nice but does not offer much more space than the 101 with the added cost and hassle of a 6X6 drive train. On either truck, as one of the others stated, you will be looking at an outdoor toilet and shower facilities. To fit 4 people in a 101 ambi you will most likely have to think of two sleeping inside and a RTT for the others. Plenty of people have done lifting roofs too for more head room. The 101 ambi has a bulkhead between the cab and rear body. Removing this frees up much more useful space for a camper build. A 101 ambi also has an advantage that it can just fit inside a shipping container should you plan any trips to exotic climes.

2. The Volvo is flat out at 65MPH while a 101 can go faster if you are brave. The 55-65 speed limit applies to most ex military vehicles as armies just don't travel fast. If you want a fast camper start on a modern van chassis as FF suggests. The speed limiting factor on my 101 GS has always been the front prop grumble. There are ways to address this but it is not easy. The 101 has the advantage of having a drivetrain that has much in common with the RR meaning speed mods are comparatively simple. My GS has the original drive train with the V8 rebuilt with the higher compression RR pistons and more modern, bigger valve 4.0L heads plus the .9962 transfer gear conversion. It can touch >120KPH but realistically, because of the speed rating of bar grip tyres (I like to live an exciting, unpredictable life) I can cruise at 100KPH all day long. When my wife was young and in love we drove the 101 from AZ to Colorado, LA, Lake Tahoe and other long runs. My camper conversion amounted to throwing a tent and a camp stove in the back. I now have it in Switzerland (Tyre howl and V8 sound goood in the frequent tunnels here) and have driven up to Normandy plus a few other long runs but it does mean they are less frequent. It is slower and less comfortable than any modern car but nicer than running my old 71 IIA.

2. For any decent comfort with an internal toilet and shower a 7.5 tonner is really where it starts size wise. The T244 offers a lot for the money and has good components but you are still limited in speed. If you don't care about speed too much and want something really off the wall I see there are a couple of shop body, ex Swiss Army, CCKW GMCs on milweb right now. Plenty of space and still plenty or parts and support.

3. If you get serious about a 101 camper look up Able Engineering known as 101parts.com. The owner has a VERY sweet 101 ambi camper and has used his experience to provide lots of the parts to keep a 101 running (You will replace the alloy fuel tank sooner or later) and also lots of well engineered mod kits like the aforementioned 4 wheel disc brake kit. Many of the mechanical modifications are as simple as buying a kit. He is good for a good chat about all things 101 and is probably the most knowledgeable person to talk to on the practicalities of doing one.

4. The 101 shares most mechanical parts with either the Series or RR (The brakes are shared with the Volvo oddly enough) and bearings and seals can all be cross referenced to standard items. The chassis is unique but you can get most repair sections and most other 101 specific parts from 101parts. The body is all flat panels so is easy to work with. It really is one of the easier military vehicles to keep running.

4. Those eyes with the shackles on that camper are NOT for recovery. They are also NOT for lifting with a helicopter (Those eyes are in the footwells and have much bigger bolts). The eyes on the front and rear cross members are for tie downs when the truck is transported either by ship or internally by aircraft or, if you are unlucky, to attach it to the pallet when said vehicle is thrown out the back of the aircraft.

5. The 101 ambis were not supplied with a winch but the Nokken can be fitted as all chassis were the same. This winch is very versatile allowing front or rear recovery, 65m of cable and V8 power with multiple speeds through the gearbox. If you want the Nokken you need to keep the LT95 for the PTO which is another reason to keep the V8.

6. If you choose to search for a 101 ambi go and look on the club web pages as they have by far the greatest throughput of vehicles.

As to my brother's final choice. He ended up buying a used Jeep Grand Cherokee and a caravan.

 

[miketomcat]

Thanks for the input. As I said from the beginning this was very much vapour. I would still quite like to do one but it's unlikely to happen. More likely is a home built caravan/camping trailer but we will see what happens.

Mike

[greenmeanie]

I completely understand. I am currently in the process of convincing my wife a Stolly is a perfectly sane thing to buy as a mid life crisis for a retired engineer with three old Rovers already requiring attention. I am making progress as she is down to 'I'll divorce you the day it shows up' which is a marginal improvement on 'No. It will NEVER happen.'

[garrycol]

An acquaintance of mine has a Stolly (as well as a 101GS) and has been working on it for years - easier if you dont want it to float but then of course everyone does.

There is another Stolly I know of where the owner converted it as a "exped vehicle" - was 2wd on the road, economical diesel etc etc - unfortunately while returning from a military event it got rear ended by a huge semi trailer (B double - two trailers) and got rolled a few times with the owner in hospital for 6 months - the Stolly came off second best and was a technical right off but I am sure in the years ahead it may get resurrected.

[greenmeanie]

I think I read about that accident on the HVMF forum. He had made some really good mods making his Stolly far easier to live with. Your man was lucky to survive and I hope made a full recovery.

I see plenty of damage to the cargo doors and the supporting frames. Did the hull get twisted as that would probably be the deal breaker as far as resurrection goes over just building the good parts onto another.

[FridgeFreezer]

18 hours ago, greenmeanie said:

This is an interesting topic which I have been through recently with a brother who fancied an old military vehicle as the base for a camper build for his wife and two dogs. Some comments from his investigations:

1. The Volvo 6X6 is nice but does not offer much more space than the 101 with the added cost and hassle of a 6X6 drive train. On either truck, as one of the others stated, you will be looking at an outdoor toilet and shower facilities. To fit 4 people in a 101 ambi you will most likely have to think of two sleeping inside and a RTT for the others. Plenty of people have done lifting roofs too for more head room. The 101 ambi has a bulkhead between the cab and rear body. Removing this frees up much more useful space for a camper build. A 101 ambi also has an advantage that it can just fit inside a shipping container should you plan any trips to exotic climes.

2. The Volvo is flat out at 65MPH while a 101 can go faster if you are brave. The 55-65 speed limit applies to most ex military vehicles as armies just don't travel fast. If you want a fast camper start on a modern van chassis as FF suggests. The speed limiting factor on my 101 GS has always been the front prop grumble. There are ways to address this but it is not easy. The 101 has the advantage of having a drivetrain that has much in common with the RR meaning speed mods are comparatively simple. My GS has the original drive train with the V8 rebuilt with the higher compression RR pistons and more modern, bigger valve 4.0L heads plus the .9962 transfer gear conversion. It can touch >120KPH but realistically, because of the speed rating of bar grip tyres (I like to live an exciting, unpredictable life) I can cruise at 100KPH all day long. When my wife was young and in love we drove the 101 from AZ to Colorado, LA, Lake Tahoe and other long runs. My camper conversion amounted to throwing a tent and a camp stove in the back. I now have it in Switzerland (Tyre howl and V8 sound goood in the frequent tunnels here) and have driven up to Normandy plus a few other long runs but it does mean they are less frequent. It is slower and less comfortable than any modern car but nicer than running my old 71 IIA.

2. For any decent comfort with an internal toilet and shower a 7.5 tonner is really where it starts size wise. The T244 offers a lot for the money and has good components but you are still limited in speed. If you don't care about speed too much and want something really off the wall I see there are a couple of shop body, ex Swiss Army, CCKW GMCs on milweb right now. Plenty of space and still plenty or parts and support.

3. If you get serious about a 101 camper look up Able Engineering known as 101parts.com. The owner has a VERY sweet 101 ambi camper and has used his experience to provide lots of the parts to keep a 101 running (You will replace the alloy fuel tank sooner or later) and also lots of well engineered mod kits like the aforementioned 4 wheel disc brake kit. Many of the mechanical modifications are as simple as buying a kit. He is good for a good chat about all things 101 and is probably the most knowledgeable person to talk to on the practicalities of doing one.

4. The 101 shares most mechanical parts with either the Series or RR (The brakes are shared with the Volvo oddly enough) and bearings and seals can all be cross referenced to standard items. The chassis is unique but you can get most repair sections and most other 101 specific parts from 101parts. The body is all flat panels so is easy to work with. It really is one of the easier military vehicles to keep running.

4. Those eyes with the shackles on that camper are NOT for recovery. They are also NOT for lifting with a helicopter (Those eyes are in the footwells and have much bigger bolts). The eyes on the front and rear cross members are for tie downs when the truck is transported either by ship or internally by aircraft or, if you are unlucky, to attach it to the pallet when said vehicle is thrown out the back of the aircraft.

5. The 101 ambis were not supplied with a winch but the Nokken can be fitted as all chassis were the same. This winch is very versatile allowing front or rear recovery, 65m of cable and V8 power with multiple speeds through the gearbox. If you want the Nokken you need to keep the LT95 for the PTO which is another reason to keep the V8.

6. If you choose to search for a 101 ambi go and look on the club web pages as they have by far the greatest throughput of vehicles.

As to my brother's final choice. He ended up buying a used Jeep Grand Cherokee and a caravan.

 

Just to be a tad pedantic...

1. The long wheelbase (troop carrier) C303 6x6's have a LOT more space than a 101 and (I believe) are rated to 7.5t all up. At a very rough guess the load bed is approaching 1.5 to twice that of a 101. The all-in-one radio body style ones are smaller and shorter.

2. The Volvo is no slower than a 101 from the factory, and with gearing (higher ratio diffs from the 4x4) and/or engine improvements they will happily clip along at any speed you dare. There was a load of old poo talked in the early days of portal conversions that the portal gears wouldn't hack it at speed and would overheat but it's total BS, my 109 will cruise along at 80mph all day if I can afford the fuel

[garrycol]

2 hours ago, greenmeanie said:

I see plenty of damage to the cargo doors and the supporting frames. Did the hull get twisted as that would probably be the deal breaker as far as resurrection goes over just building the good parts onto another.

I am not sure of the specific damage but when about 90 tonnes doing 100kph rams your little 10 tonne Stalwart up the back end and pushes you off the highway and in doing so rolls you a number of times the damage has to be substantial.

Edited March 6, 2021 by garrycol

[greenmeanie]

Double post

 

Edited March 6, 2021 by greenmeanie
Double post

[greenmeanie]

Posted just now

 

Well here is the spec sheet for the TGB. I looked at the TGB1314 for my brother as it has the large box body making it a more practical camper. 

https://up.picr.de/36640288zx.pdf

1. The TGB1314 has a Kerb weight of 3360kg (No doubt you can drop this by stripping the ambi and surplus military equipment) and a total weight of 4500kg giving a payload of 1140kg. The 101 ambi has a kerb weight of 2.4T IIRC and a GVW of 3.5T giving a very similar payload capacity. The box for the TGB has approximate external dimensions of 3.35L X 1850 H X 1.9W while the 101 ambi has a rear dimensions 2.35L X 1625H X 2130W giving relative volumes TGB:11.83 101: 8.13 cubic meters. This is rather simplistic as it ignores such things as wheel arches and the aforementioned bulkhead removal on the 101. The TGB has more space but it is not a lot for the extra hassle of a 6X6 and greater vehicle size and with 4 people you will still live a semi outdoor existence. As I think you stated far better to go up to a 7.5 tonner.

2. The TGB1314 max speed in 4th high ratio is 92kph or just over 57mph. The max book speed for the 101 is 79mph which I agree is optimistic but it will cruise at 65mph all day and wind up to 70mph well enough. You can play with diffs on both trucks with the 101 having the advantage that DANA 60 R&P fit giving a wider range of options. You can tune the Volvo engine for more power but everything up to a 4.6 Rover V8 is a simple nut and bolt swap on the 101 giving it the power to cruise at higher speed without feeling stressed.

For 4 people the TGB does not offer enough space over the 101 for less performance. The T244 would be a far, far better platform than both.

 

[miketomcat]

Err fridge was referring to the troop carrier tgb20 6.05 total length and 5700kg gvw. But I agree the T244 is much better option. As I've said before I think I could make any of the above work (I'm a boatbuilder so used to small alkward spaces) but it'll be finance's that kill the truck idea. 

Mike

 

[Bowie69]

Came across this recent video:

 

 

Few notes.... 

• HOW did that rear box weigh 2.5t?!?!?!?

 

No, just one point actually.

 

Interesting that he used twistlocks to hold it all one, as per our very own @Ed Poore and his 6x6, though I suspect anything Ed puts on the back will be better engineered!

[Ed Poore]

25 minutes ago, Bowie69 said:

Interesting that he used twistlocks to hold it all one, as per our very own @Ed Poore and his 6x6, though I suspect anything Ed puts on the back will be better engineered!

Errr, no pressure then  although I was wondering whether I should enlist Mike's services to help build this when I get around to it.

[Bowie69]

14 minutes ago, Ed Poore said:

Errr, no pressure then  although I was wondering whether I should enlist Mike's services to help build this when I get around to it.

 

I hardly think you will breach even 1000Kg.... in that respect, it will be better engineered for certain.