OT(ish) - Trailers and transporting 110's

[Maverik]

Looking for any insights...

Looking to buy a general purpose trailer - one of the main jobs it will be taking on will include, moving some Landy's about, one particular one will be a 110.

I don't want to just buy a huge car bias trailer, so was thinking about a flatbed ifor LM146 - which is 14ft x 6.5ft anyone used one before for moving a 110, technically it will fit, but not a lot of adjustment room for it...

Anyone any thoughts or words of wisdom?

Cheers

Mav

 

[muddy]

You can't go far wrong with an Ifor, they are rough and rattle like hell but they hold their money and will stand a lot of abuse.After some kind of wiring work nearly everyone you buy will want brakes and cables, probably a hitch damper and possibly some spring eye bushings none of which is a big job.Brand new wheels and 195 tyres are around £75 each its not worth refurbing old wheels.

You can fit a 110 on a 12' but you wouldn't want to be doing much motorway work. I have had 12, 14 and 16' and I am looking to go 18' for the next one but probably a Brian James cargo as the tilt would be useful for me with my vans and you can have 12" wheels but I think ill keep the ifor for the dirty work.

Going to tri-axle will cost you 110kgs of payload but they do ride nicer IMHO (current trailer is a 16' tri axle)

One thing that's rubbish with ifors is lashing points, if you have sides you need the points in the floor otherwise you are trying to put straps under the sides or over the sides and bending them. These can be retrofitted but it's a pain of a job cutting a square hole and then welding the spreader plate on underneath. On this one I had some plates plasma cut and welded them on as I was refurbing it.

 

 

I tend to carry a mixture of vehicles and more agricultural equipment or pointy bits of steel that put localised pressure on the floor and I think the ifor suits this, the Brian James, Bateson and tilting ifors are lovely looking trailers and are much better for vehicles but they arnt quite as robust in the bed IMHO.

 

One of its more sensible loads.

 

Edit: general rule of thumb with an ifor, put the handbrake on after moving the trailer forwards a couple of feet if the lever goes over 45 degrees the brakes need adjusting, there are slots in the backplates to check the shoes.

 

[Ed Poore]

Are you looking for new or used?

If you're looking at new it would be worth having a chat with Mark (new boss) at CLH Trailers, they don't really do "standard" as all their trailers are customisable - I think he said he had 7 variations of their 14ft flatbed. Their trailers tow far nicer than any Ifor, GE or Bateman.

Personally having borrowed and used a variety of trailers I'd be going as long as practical, it gives you more versatility on load centre. Once you've towed once with a badly loaded 110 on it you won't get the balance wrong ever again! A point worth noting is that if you do any DIY etc., then timber tends to come in ~16ft lengths. So a 16 or 18fter will fit them flat on the bed so you don't need to strap them down not find somewhere to tie the tailgate too. They're also a damn sight easier to get into small spaces (ironically) particularly reversing as things move slower as I'm sure you know.

One thing you might find with the triaxles is that you have to get the hitch on the Defender at the right height, they're not that easy to lift up or down to adjust. I found on my 110 that even on the lowest tow ball setting it's still a bit high to easily hitch up most triple axles and then you're trying to lift it up. The only one I haven't had to do that on was a neighbours triple axle Ifor cattle trailer but he'd that built slightly differently because it was always going to be towed behind his big Valtra.

[Arjan]

For what it is worth.......

Towed with almost any make trailers over the decades and far too many weird loads and Land Rovers.

If you have the money, give a 3-axle a try. After Brexit you may have some limited choice but if you can find a Hulco trailer - this is a 3500 kgs. 4 mtr. one. - you get a very nice trailer. I regularly tow the 6.20 x 2.20 mtr. version and they are awesome. When you are thinking of towing 110's than I'd def. go for a 3-axle.

 

[elbekko]

3-axles are nice and stable, I've done a fair bit of towing with @Escape's 3-axle Ifor TB. The biggest downside is manoeuvering on uneven surfaces, it'll swap the wheel it's pivoting on on a whim, which can be a bit annoying.

And seconded with the lashing points, it could really do with a bit of holesaw treatment.

Overall: go as big in size and capacity as you can get away with, you'll never regret having a trailer that's slightly too big for the load.

[Escape]

I agree with @elbekko, our tri axle Ifor has served us very well for all kinds of jobs. Some points could be improved, such as the locks for the tilting bed (already upgraded those) and the addition of more lashing points and hooks.

It's 16.5ft (5m), which means even a 130 can be loaded where you want it. Extra length is rarely a problem, but if the trailer is much wider than the towing vehicle that does mean extra care is needed on narrow roads. My previous trailer was 2.25m, this one is only 2m and that makes a big difference squeezing through traffic etc. And still plenty wide for cars or to fit 2 pallets side by side.
It can tilt, but the bed does have reinforcement beams so localised loads are not really a problem.
I was hesitant to chose a tri axle when buying it, but haven't regretted it. It only weighs 50kg more than the equivalent double axle and because of the smaller wheels the center of gravity is lower. I do need to replace the tyres soon, that will obviously cost more. I wouldn't be surprised if the price per tyre is higher as well, because the size is not as common. For maneuvering by hand I tend to use the tilt function, so it rides on 3 instead of 7 wheels. Loaded is a different proposition. The Range doesn't really mind but as above on uneven ground the turning point can vary a bit so you need to be on top of things if space is limited.

 

[miketomcat]

I'd definitely go 16ft bed for a 110 as above you'll only get it in the wrong place once either because your underwear is brown or worse.... 16ft allows you to put the engine on the front of the trailer and the rest of the 110 behind it You can't do that with a 14ft. Worth noting that the only way you can move a twin axle around by hand is with the jockey wheel wound up till one set of wheels is off the ground, a Tri is likely to be worse and you certainly can't do this with a load on it.

Mike

[Happyoldgit]

Shame, I recently sold my 16x6.5 twin axle Ifor tilt bed that had a new phenolic ply floor just last year. I’m not a lover of tri axles but that’s just me.

[Hollywood500]

It depends what you’re going to use it for most, if you’re going to mainly be transporting Land Rovers over a decent distance (for me anything over 30-40 miles) then a decent sized transporter trailer would be best. No point in getting something so universal it’s carp at all jobs.

I started with a 16foot dropside tandem but it was a pain in the arse to load, pain in the arse to strap vehicles to and didn’t necessarily feel the safest or the most relaxing to tow. After considering what my main requirements actually are I’ve since swapped to an 18ft Bateson tilt bed tri axle and it’s the best thing I’ve done. It’s happy at speed and max weight, and is a lot easier to strap vehicles to. Ironically I’ve not struggled without the dropsides, you just learn to get good with the straps!

Tri axles for me give a bit of extra reassurance if a tyre were to go especially when loaded right up, but they do like to push the tow vehicle around a bit in corners so a decent sized tow vehicle comes in handy. Just 6 sets of everything to replace unfortunately.

[L19MUD]

33 minutes ago, Hollywood500 said:

It depends what you’re going to use it for most, if you’re going to mainly be transporting Land Rovers over a decent distance (for me anything over 30-40 miles) then a decent sized transporter trailer would be best. No point in getting something so universal it’s carp at all jobs.

I started with a 16foot dropside tandem but it was a pain in the arse to load, pain in the arse to strap vehicles to and didn’t necessarily feel the safest or the most relaxing to tow. After considering what my main requirements actually are I’ve since swapped to an 18ft Bateson tilt bed tri axle and it’s the best thing I’ve done. It’s happy at speed and max weight, and is a lot easier to strap vehicles to. Ironically I’ve not struggled without the dropsides, you just learn to get good with the straps!

Tri axles for me give a bit of extra reassurance if a tyre were to go especially when loaded right up, but they do like to push the tow vehicle around a bit in corners so a decent sized tow vehicle comes in handy. Just 6 sets of everything to replace unfortunately.

I have the same tri axle tilt bed PY66 Bateson. Had a 14ft twin axle beavertail ifor and would never go back to that. Thousands of miles with all sorts of loads and the Bateson wins hands down every time. The only downside is the slightly weaker centre section over an ifor, if you are not moving 120 rollers on it I would not worry. 

[Maverik]

Thank you all for your advice, some really useful and insightful comments.

My conclusion and present mission is to look for a ~16ft tri axle jobby, tri axles seem to be less available but they're out there.

[steve200TDi]

6 hours ago, Maverik said:

Thank you all for your advice, some really useful and insightful comments.

My conclusion and present mission is to look for a ~16ft tri axle jobby, tri axles seem to be less available but they're out there.

I'll be selling mine soon, it's a Brian James triple axle tilt bed around 16ft. It's true, I haven't seen many on ebay to gauge a selling price, so that's my job this weekend to check it over, take  some pictures and make an advert!

Steve

[Maverik]

So to close this out a little. I had some time deadlines to meet so I ended up finding a 14ft tri axle ifor williams.

All advice was well heeded, but long lead times (on new) and limited availability on non ifor williams stuff kinda narrowed the running.

It's rough, noisey and overpriced, but solid on the road and it should hold its price well. I won't keep it forever but it will do for now I reckon.

Thanks all for your contributions it helped me greatly.

 

[Gazzar]

@muddy

Did you do the ratchet strap brackets yourself? What thickness did you use?

[muddy]

@Gazzar I had my friend plasma them out for me on his cnc I think they are 10 or 12 it will have been handy on his machine. I then welded them on (poorly, outside in the rain ) over the ends of the floor crossmembers so they have vertical welds aswell.

[Gazzar]

That's very helpful. Thanks. I am hoping to do a refurb on my flat bed soon, and having this as a start point well help my thinking.

[Maverik]

Just to update this, said purchased trailer was used... and it did the job... but...

 

I used the trailer for some subsequent loads of stuff and I've got to say it was the least well behaved trailer I've ever towed, I thought it might be the 90 so I was using with the Disco 2 and it was just as bad. 

It felt like you where being pushed about, pretty disconcerting when it was empty doing any overtaking, a couple of times it started to oscillate too which is pretty scary. I love driving and towing has never phased me in the slightest, but this one I found I was dreading having to use.

I've towed longer trailers and never felt that uncomfortable, the only difference I could think was that this one was a tri axle and my trucks just weren't big enough to resist it.

Any how after the last load of furniture I moved (I think I aged over the journey it was such an uncomfortable drive) I decided to trade it in, so got myself a LM126 twin as a replacement.

Other deciding factors - getting the tri axle hooked up to both my trucks was a pig as getting the trailer nose low enough to hook onto the vehicle was a 2 person job, also it was nigh on impossible to shift the trailer by yourself on anything but polished concrete.

Safe trailering people.

 

 

[elbekko]

That's very surprising to hear. The 3-axle Ifor TB is extremely stable in my experience, loaded or empty doesn't really matter. Hooking up can be a bit annoying without air suspension indeed.

[Maverik]

38 minutes ago, elbekko said:

That's very surprising to hear. The 3-axle Ifor TB is extremely stable in my experience, loaded or empty doesn't really matter. Hooking up can be a bit annoying without air suspension indeed.

To be honest it was a bit of a surprise to me too, after what I'd read, I made sure the trailer was loaded correctly, type pressures correct. It could have been operator error, but whatever I did, it didn't seem to improve the situation.

[Escape]

Sorry to hear that. You're certainly right to swap it if it made you dread towing! As @elbekko says, our tri-axle has been great, with whatever we've put on it. I think it's a bit longer and possibly on smaller wheels than the one you had. But that shouldn't matter too much. Maybe there was a mechanical problem, play in the suspension or something to make it oscillate and affect the towing vehicle? We had ours behind normal cars (empty of course) and that was no problem either.

[Ed Poore]

I wonder if your towball was a little low if you're struggling to get it on? 

All tri axles I've towed often need a little help but I've never struggled on my own to hitch it up. Admittedly I'm running 33" tyres and 110's tend to sit a bit higher at the back. Particularly in a 90 with less of an arse it may have a tendency to try and lift the towing vehicle's rear wheels. That's often where the oscillations come in. Particularly with a 110 on with no leeway forwards or backwards I'd hazard you possibly didn't get enough nose weight on the tow vehicle. Defenders have quite a high maximum permissible tow bar weight so they like having a bit more than most vehicles.

[muddy]

If you are having to push the hitch down onto the ball you have the ball set too low for sufficient nose weight. A short (12/14') tri axle will always bully the tow car unless the tow car is LWB and or heavy in my experience, Unless you have stupidly heavy springs more often than not 90's need to look 'sat on their arse' to tow nicely with more adventurous loads I think.

[Maverik]

I suspect your both right, never had an issue with the ball hight before, hopefully a learning point for others. 

[Nonimouse]

I'm surprised that you are having issues with a tri-axle Ifor. BUT. The tri-axle ifor that I use might be superb on the Disco, but it's appalling on any pickup. Snakes like a b£st£rd, even when empty. Hitch height has never been an issue but moving the hitch further back has helped a bit. 

[landroversforever]

2 hours ago, Nonimouse said:

I'm surprised that you are having issues with a tri-axle Ifor. BUT. The tri-axle ifor that I use might be superb on the Disco, but it's appalling on any pickup. Snakes like a b£st£rd, even when empty. Hitch height has never been an issue but moving the hitch further back has helped a bit. 

I think it's often an issue of a lack of weight on the back of a lot of pickups. I know a few with various triaxle trailers who find the same unless the pickup is weighed down a bit.