Aftermarket parts fails!

[oneandtwo]

My brother’s 300tdi 90 clutch failed recently. Felt like it was the usual punched through clutch fork however I was sure I fitted one of the modified HD forks when I changed the clutch for him 50k miles ago.

Turned out I had fitted a HD clutch fork, however instead of punching through the fork as with the non HD version, it wore the fork and pivot ball out, and then split the fork!

 

While I was at it gave it a full service, alloy radiator filler plug had not liked being in brass radiator!

And finally the 300tdi appears to have swallowed half of its ITG air filter that has deteriorated with age. Still runs fine!

 

 

 

[reb78]

I switched to a brass rad plug for exactly the reason you have found with yours. Right size can be found on ebay and theybdont dissolve like aspirin!

[Mossberg]

Wow, that's not good on the rad plug - well not good on the clutch fork either!

Not sure what that air filter goes on but I would guess at the moment I can't see it being very efficient. 

[miketomcat]

I use a brass plug, standard paper filter and a hd clutch fork.

Paper filter is far better because you have to change it every year rather than leave it year in year out.

And I've had the same fork failure.

Mike

[oneandtwo]

Yep, brass plug and paper filter now fitted.

LOF once made a machined billet clutch fork with nylon pivot inserts for the 300tdi but only made one batch, for some reason they never re-manufactured it

[steve b]

After market pattern parts that don't fit and/or fail..............

This could run for years 

latest ones ...

Supplied defender heater box to BH seal , pattern , had to cut about 12mm off it's width to get it to fit.

Another recent one, Defender Lucas steering lock small ignition switch module , the outer mazak casting diameter was too big for the lock housing . Sorted with some patient flap wheel fitting...

And another , SS Defender door hinge bolt kit , the countersunk screw heads are too big for the counterbore in the hinge..... more fitting with a flap wheel.

Series Military under seat fill new pattern tanks that the neck is too small for the filler tube and the caps don't seal or lock to a stop , fixed by welding in the old tank top into the new ones , I mean truly WTF are these manufacturers and suppliers on ???

Series door seals that just don't fit - too deep/wide/thick/rigid

Series vent flap seals - the same

Pattern side/brake/indicator light units for 300 Tdi Defender onwards don't fit the Factory bulb holder

.........and breathe 

The list is endless when you get into it 

Series rad coolant hoses that are the same diameter outside as the stub they are going onto.....

Steve 

 

 

[Gazzar]

What really gets me is that it costs just as much to do it right as wrong. 

[hurbie]

i think the main reason is , people don't complain enough when they have a faulty part . they just swallow it and go on ....

even Britpart come with a 2 year warranty .... but if they don't get recalls on faulty parts , they must asume there perfect ...

Edited October 14, 2023 by hurbie

[steve b]

Yep

The fuel tanks really hammered that home. 

In a previous life I was an Engineer in a major mass/batch production factory so have a deep understanding of QC and consistent quality tooling and manufacture.

Even more frustrating is suppliers/anufacturers completely ignoring any feedback that questions the product.

Steve

[steve b]

@hurbie, 7 years ago I stupidly ordered a full set of road springs for a 109 S3 from Bearmach.

I fitted the front springs and fully built they did not deflect at all with the wheels  on the deck.

Pulled them off and made a test rig and loaded a single spring with known mass ( several sheets of 2m x 1m 10mm thick steel ) and to get to standard ride height from pad to bump stop it took 800kg .....that is near to the total front axle to road max mass. 

I sent a detailed email report including pictures to BM and was never acknowledged, and just to drop a cherry on top it took 7 months to get refunded.

Replaced with springs from Jones. Bolt up and go . Perfectly engineered by real Engineers.

Steve 

[Snagger]

14 hours ago, steve b said:

After market pattern parts that don't fit and/or fail..............

This could run for years 

latest ones ...

Supplied defender heater box to BH seal , pattern , had to cut about 12mm off it's width to get it to fit.

Another recent one, Defender Lucas steering lock small ignition switch module , the outer mazak casting diameter was too big for the lock housing . Sorted with some patient flap wheel fitting...

And another , SS Defender door hinge bolt kit , the countersunk screw heads are too big for the counterbore in the hinge..... more fitting with a flap wheel.

Series Military under seat fill new pattern tanks that the neck is too small for the filler tube and the caps don't seal or lock to a stop , fixed by welding in the old tank top into the new ones , I mean truly WTF are these manufacturers and suppliers on ???

Series door seals that just don't fit - too deep/wide/thick/rigid

Series vent flap seals - the same

Pattern side/brake/indicator light units for 300 Tdi Defender onwards don't fit the Factory bulb holder

.........and breathe 

The list is endless when you get into it 

Series rad coolant hoses that are the same diameter outside as the stub they are going onto.....

Steve 

 

 

All of that sounds like standard Britpart - I had that with a few of their components.

[steve b]

29 minutes ago, Snagger said:

All of that sounds like standard Britpart - I had that with a few of their components.

That is all there is now for many parts. If genuine is available then that is what I recommend . 

The Heater to BH seal was BP and supplied by the client. The genuine item is entirely different and an easy fit....

I fitted a full set of genuine shocks last year (to a coiler) and the vehicle was back in a month with rattles at the back, both bottom shock upper bushes were missing and the lower bushes were splitting too.....

A few of us in this area are discussing series door seals and vent seals with a local specialist rubber extruder, if anything comes of it I'll post it on the forum.

Steve

[Snagger]

It is awful.  It was always an issue, and I remember reading pleas by professional mechanics, amateur enthusiasts, magazine writers and more to support the companies making the good stuff, even though they cost more, as otherwise they will cease and we will only be left with the rubbish.  It seems that has come to pass.  We can only hope that as the old vehicles are increasingly seen as classics, especially by LR (who’s senior mgmt seem disgusted but willing to cash in through their restoration scheme), that more parts may be produced to a reasonable standard.

[ThreePointFive]

The choice between unobtainable genuine parts (not even talking about cost) and Britpart as the sole aftermarket supplier has killed all of our vehicles. It might not take effect for 20+ years for some, but  critical parts to the operation of the vehicle will slowly fail over time and there will be nothing to replace them with.

Sounds dramatic until you realise that a part that doesn't fit is no more useful than trying to bolt a raw potato in its place. 

[JeffR]

My favourite was a set of Stainless brake hoses from Britpart (yes I know, but needed them in a hurry). Two bloody days and a couple of gallons of of brake fluid later and still no functional front brakes. Assaulted hoses with angle grinder to find two out of four hoses were solid nylon rod covered in stainless mesh.... Britpart were about as helpful as a Tax inspection.

[Snagger]

11 minutes ago, JeffR said:

My favourite was a set of Stainless brake hoses from Britpart (yes I know, but needed them in a hurry). Two bloody days and a couple of gallons of of brake fluid later and still no functional front brakes. Assaulted hoses with angle grinder to find two out of four hoses were solid nylon rod covered in stainless mesh.... Britpart were about as helpful as a Tax inspection.

I have heard of that on their normal hoses, and of hoses being incorrectly staged so the unions separated as soon as moderate pressure was applied.  Then there is the shaft in cylinders, aluminium castings like Aero bars, mismatched and incorrect dimension brake linings…

[Snagger]

30 minutes ago, ThreePointFive said:

The choice between unobtainable genuine parts (not even talking about cost) and Britpart as the sole aftermarket supplier has killed all of our vehicles. It might not take effect for 20+ years for some, but  critical parts to the operation of the vehicle will slowly fail over time and there will be nothing to replace them with.

Sounds dramatic until you realise that a part that doesn't fit is no more useful than trying to bolt a raw potato in its place. 

I think I might make an order of lots of service consumables like filters, brake pads and so on and keep a stash.  Expensive in the short term, but likely to be cost effective in the long run.

[Mossberg]

16 hours ago, Snagger said:

I think I might make an order of lots of service consumables like filters, brake pads and so on and keep a stash.  Expensive in the short term, but likely to be cost effective in the long run.

Personally I think filters and pads are one thing that will be available from quality manufacturers in the future, together with bearings and (mechanical) seals. 

I think many other things will suffer the britpart curse, especially things like window/door seals, electrical, and pressed/machined parts.

I would hope that perhaps a supplier could potentially see the market for higher quality parts. Also it would only take a slight shift from britpart to actually work on their quality control. How many times do you get a part and think "why don't they just put the correct diameter hole in the right place"?

[Green Bob]

1 hour ago, Mossberg said:

How many times do you get a part and think "why don't they just put the correct diameter hole in the right place"?

In fairness, you could ask the same of Solihull!

[ThreePointFive]

3 hours ago, Mossberg said:

Personally I think filters and pads are one thing that will be available from quality manufacturers in the future, together with bearings and (mechanical) seals. 

I think many other things will suffer the britpart curse, especially things like window/door seals, electrical, and pressed/machined parts.

I would hope that perhaps a supplier could potentially see the market for higher quality parts. Also it would only take a slight shift from britpart to actually work on their quality control. How many times do you get a part and think "why don't they just put the correct diameter hole in the right place"?

I agree, the consumables are still abundant from good suppliers, as are things like clutches and some of the related components. It's the LR-specific stuff that can degrade just being sat on a shed shelf long term that worries me. 

The problem with the market for a middle ground quality supplier is that it's been tried. Bearmach were very good until their last few years, but they couldn't shift the volume of someone like Britpart so the profitability is much lower on parts that are already more expensive to buy (for them).

A lot of owners aren't willing or able to maintain a vehicle on anything above absolute minimum cost, so BP became their default supplier despite knowing the longer term cost would be higher. 

Then you have the fact that most garages will fit the cheapest part they can for any job, as they aren't as worried as they need to be about the longevity of their repairs. Now there's no choice, it only strengthens BP's grip and makes it impenetrable by anyone else.

Coupled together, it's very difficult for a business to operate at scale and be viable in the middle of the market.

[Steve King]

Several years ago I changed the clutch master and slave cylinders on my then current 300 TDi Defender. Unfortunately the replacements arrived in blue boxes!

After a month I was in the middle of a busy one way system and as I pressed the clutch down to engage first gear there was a loud bang and I was drenched from head to toe in hydraulic fluid!! Happy Days!!

This time a genuine master cylinder was used, but I left the aftermarket slave cylinder in place and it was still working when i came to sell the vehic1le

[monkie]

For me it would be oil seals I'd put at the top of the list. They simply just don't seal to the point I wonder why they still sell them. Lesson learned the hard way for me when I did my first rear crank seal only to find it didn't seal... So, oil on the floor, £10 on a new genuine seal, another day to remove the engine, fit the new seal and put the engine back in again... I now consider this a life lesson and keep a good distance between myself and cheap oil seals at all times!

[Snagger]

7 hours ago, monkie said:

For me it would be oil seals I'd put at the top of the list. They simply just don't seal to the point I wonder why they still sell them. Lesson learned the hard way for me when I did my first rear crank seal only to find it didn't seal... So, oil on the floor, £10 on a new genuine seal, another day to remove the engine, fit the new seal and put the engine back in again... I now consider this a life lesson and keep a good distance between myself and cheap oil seals at all times!

Britpart seal is an oxymoron.  Does anyone remember the magazine rebuild of a magazine owner’s white Santayana (Lindsay Porter is a name that rings a bell).  I can’t remember which of the magazines it was, but it was rebuilt with Britpart stock at a Britpart workshop by Britpart staff.  Once the had rebuilt the axles, the refilled the fluids.  The next months edition showed pools of oil under the hubs and leaking down the inside of the tyres, under the diffs and the gear box.  Not old leaks that had been mopped up and left stains, mind, but wet, deep, fresh leaks.  It’s the same with their hydraulics, and their bearings are all square and made of toffee.  They do a few good bits, in fairness, but it’s so hard to find them and their G suffix means nothing in reality.

[Mossberg]

When I bought my Defender, it was because I believed the parts were so cheap (in relation to other manufacturers parts) that it's upkeep should attainable with limited funds. However, from learning how to maintain the vehicle from forums and youtube (selective reading and watching) it soon became apparent that cheapest isn't always the best option. 

When I got my Defender it was one of the cheapest available and as such some things were tired, including brakes and swivels. My thoughts were to do other work whilst doing the jobs, so bearings and seals were done. Using Timken bearings and Corteco seals tripled the price of using Britpart, but I felt it would be a better job.

Whilst I avoid Britpart for critical parts, I also avoid "Land Rover " parts too due to the huge cost. For critical parts I look for branded which for serviceable parts there do seem to be decent suppliers. I have done timing belt, water pump and other parts doing this.

However, when I replaced my brake calipers I used Britpart and they are working fine. I did however use branded pads as recommended by Mike at Britannica Restorations - I do find his reviews quite good as he obviously fits a lot of parts and with shipping to Canada the reliability of those parts is important. 

[Snagger]

Unlike the magazines, which have sponsorships and ad revenue to protect, he is independent and quite outspoken about their quality issues. 😂