Thoughts and Musings on the Ineos Grenadier

[Happyoldgit]

17 minutes ago, deep said:

You should look around.  They don't make older stuff any more.  We are discussing new vehicles...

You know full well what I mean. 

[Snagger]

21 hours ago, elbekko said:

DRLs are ok for Swedish law, for the record. Doesn't need to be headlights anymore.

I put brighter bulbs into my sidelights so I could use them as DRLs. Actually noticeably reduces the invisibility cloak my P38 seems to come with.

My Volvo has them.  I don’t see the benefit over their old system, only negatives, but EU homologation would require the change.  No doubt some MEPs and bureaucrats got a nice layover by the DRL manufacturers to mandate them.

[jeremy996]

LROi review of the Ineos Grenadier. My subscription copy landed this morning.

 

 

 

[landroversforever]

54 minutes ago, Snagger said:

My Volvo has them.  I don’t see the benefit over their old system, only negatives, but EU homologation would require the change.  No doubt some MEPs and bureaucrats got a nice layover by the DRL manufacturers to mandate them.

I really don't see much benefit to the manufacturers of them..... just look how many are just a part of existing lights. Vast majority are just using the side lights in a brighter setting. 

[elbekko]

And for the doubters: you'll understand constant headlight use when you live somewhere where the sun is very low in the sky for a good part of the year, and easily obscures vehicles. Having the lights on does actually help with that a lot.

[Daan]

3 hours ago, jeremy996 said:

LROi review of the Ineos Grenadier. My subscription copy landed this morning.

 

 

 

Interesting to see LRO testing it, as it is not a Landrover. I bet they are not a big fan of the new defender either. Might have to buy that mag.

[Escape]

A bit late to the party, but I'm with @Chicken Drumstick on the automatic wipers and headlights. The wipers always seem to come on when not needed, like that time I was driving a (borrowed) C63AMG and giving it a bit more throttle in an uphill corner only to have something pass in front of me for no reasons whatsoever. Only a little irritation, but it did deduct from the experience. And that's the only remotely modern (2014) car I can still get along with, for obvious reasons.
Even if the automatic wipers may be better suited in rapidly changing conditions, I still prefer a compromised interval setting I can control if and when I want. It may not be perfectly timed, but it will be predictable, instead of having to wait for the ECU to decide to wipe or not.

Same for the lights, with the addition that most of the moderns I see no longer have an 'off' setting for the headlights. Especially some French brands seem to have the sensor triggered but the shadows when driving under a bridge, only for the lights to come on when exiting said bridge. And then staying on 'till just before the next bridge... Ridiculous! Especially as those same cars often run without lights in fog or rain.
I also agree that headlights don't always offer the best visibility. Sure, you'll see that there is a vehicle, but you'll often be unable to see other details, like cyclists or pedestrians. Especially when it's not dark, but the bright lights do effect your vision. And I also often run with sidelights only. For example in light rain, as they will give a better indication to oncoming traffic, without the risk of glare headlights can produce, and more importantly, they will alert cars coming up behind me, especially important if there is some spray from the wheels. That's something DRLs don't offer and I really don't see the point of those at all. Back in the day when that was still possible, I always took the effort to dig into the menu to turn the DRLs off before taking my dad's car.

Main thing, be it wipers or headlight, as a driver you should expect to do some work, to be engaged in the drive, not just push the loud pedal and let the car sort everything else out.

I guess that explains why I'm so adamant about keeping my old cars running for as long as I can. 🙂 And why the Grenadier doesn't really appeal to me. Autobox only and digital dash (with little info from what I've read), it wouldn't need automatic wipers to irritate me.

Filip

[elbekko]

2 hours ago, Escape said:

instead of having to wait for the ECU to decide to wipe or not.

There's still a perfectly usable button to trigger a manual wipe. And an off setting. Just a nicer interval that you don't have to babysit.

[landroversforever]

Apart from odd moments of madness my daily’s auto wipers are usually pretty good. Can still always turn them on manually or just a single flick. And the sensitivity when in auto can be adjusted easily on the fly. 

[Retroanaconda]

I turned the automatic wipers off on the 110 almost straight away, much prefer to control them manually.

The lights work fine though, they come on when needed and go off when not - can’t ask for much more than that.

On a related note - it’s good to see carp wipers that done clear the whole screen are a feature lovingly reproduced from the Defender 

[Bowie69]

On 2/9/2023 at 6:00 PM, landroversforever said:

I'm afraid before making such claims you have to surrender the keys and your credit card for extensive 3rd party testing. I'm happy make the sacrifice and put myself forward for this. 

You can have a drive for certain, next time we bump into each other -as long as your sensible 😛 

[FridgeFreezer]

On 2/10/2023 at 5:53 AM, Naks said:

Mate, you've got it all wrong: the whole point about an engine limp mode is that it enables to LIMP somewhere and get help without destroying the engine/gearbox/etc. 

Limp mode is there to protect the engine from the average idiot who will drive it flat out with the oil light on and then claim under warranty.

Sometimes it can be good/helpful (Ford using cylinder deactivation to cool an overheating engine for example) but sometimes due to over-caution stuff will drop into limp mode at the drop of a hat which can be far worse, especially for more extreme scenarios (EG being shot at) where you would really like to have the ability to make the decision yourself on whether to sacrifice the engine in order to keep moving.

My partner's Seat dropping into limp mode half-way down a motorway slip road because it decided the accelerator pedal was not to be trusted could so nearly have been a serious accident.

[jeremy996]

My experience of modern LRs limp modes suggests that they go into limp for some silly reasons, a bit like a horse bolting after seeing an angry daisy! Some sensor faults will trigger limping, when the only thing that has failed was the sensor and a mid-value would allow the vehicle to function. By all means, light up the dash like a Christmas tree, but don't make it slower than a granny on a bike or brick the vehicle unless it really needs it. 

Back in the mid-2000s I bought a BMW 5 Series as a work car which went into limp mode, (max 20kph), each time I was on the Bescote acceleration lane onto the M6. Bribing an ex-army mate, now last resort auto-electrician, with a crate of beer to do his electronic voodoo on the vehicle, (as the dealer had failed to find a real fault 4 times), it turned out that the wiring loom had been stretched and the only permanent fix would be to replace the loom. I rejected the car and ended up buying my LR110CSW. 

[jeremy996]

Just after 16:00 today, I got an update e-mail from Ineos.

Hi Jeremy, In the production update from our Hambach factory earlier this month, our CEO, Lynn Calder, made two commitments.  One was that, as Grenadiers reach our first customers, we communicate more frequently. The other was that quality remains our number one priority.  PRODUCTION UPDATE In line with this priority, all vehicles continue to be subject to the ‘batch and hold’ process. This means they are still undergoing additional, rigorous checks. These continue to slow us down. But, we’re still making progress. We are now seeing the first vehicles leaving Hambach en route to our retailer partners. And we’ve issued almost 1,000 additional contracts this week as we ramp up production of customer vehicles.  CHALLENGING TERRAIN. TOUGH CROWD As Lynn Calder alluded to, the world’s media put the Grenadier through its paces on an epic journey starting in the Scottish Highlands. How did our rugged 4X4s cope with the challenging terrain and weather? There are over 297 first impressions online and available to read, to help you find out. Here’s one to get you started.   "So during two full days of off-road driving through the beautiful wilds of the Scottish Highlands, I can affirm I always had every confidence in the Grenadier's old-school off-roading ability. And that included negotiating some really hairy narrow mountainous tracks in pitch dark with nothing but air, gravity, and a prayer between me and the loch far below."   READ THE REVIEW >

We know how frustrating the wait must be, and we want nothing more than to see you, our customers, behind the wheels of your Grenadiers. We’ll continue to keep you updated with news on your Grenadier. And, as part of our commitment to communicate more frequently, we’ll share another update in two weeks’ time. But, of course, if you have any questions or concerns, please get in touch. CONTACT US > Thank you for your continued support, The Grenadier team

[reb78]

On 2/23/2023 at 11:28 PM, jeremy996 said:

Just after 16:00 today, I got an update e-mail from Ineos.

Hi Jeremy, In the production update from our Hambach factory earlier this month, our CEO, Lynn Calder, made two commitments.  One was that, as Grenadiers reach our first customers, we communicate more frequently. The other was that quality remains our number one priority.  PRODUCTION UPDATE In line with this priority, all vehicles continue to be subject to the ‘batch and hold’ process. This means they are still undergoing additional, rigorous checks. These continue to slow us down. But, we’re still making progress. We are now seeing the first vehicles leaving Hambach en route to our retailer partners. And we’ve issued almost 1,000 additional contracts this week as we ramp up production of customer vehicles.  CHALLENGING TERRAIN. TOUGH CROWD As Lynn Calder alluded to, the world’s media put the Grenadier through its paces on an epic journey starting in the Scottish Highlands. How did our rugged 4X4s cope with the challenging terrain and weather? There are over 297 first impressions online and available to read, to help you find out. Here’s one to get you started.   "So during two full days of off-road driving through the beautiful wilds of the Scottish Highlands, I can affirm I always had every confidence in the Grenadier's old-school off-roading ability. And that included negotiating some really hairy narrow mountainous tracks in pitch dark with nothing but air, gravity, and a prayer between me and the loch far below."   READ THE REVIEW >

We know how frustrating the wait must be, and we want nothing more than to see you, our customers, behind the wheels of your Grenadiers. We’ll continue to keep you updated with news on your Grenadier. And, as part of our commitment to communicate more frequently, we’ll share another update in two weeks’ time. But, of course, if you have any questions or concerns, please get in touch. CONTACT US > Thank you for your continued support, The Grenadier team

A communication about communication with little to communicate...!!

I am just waiting for the post where you write a review of YOUR Grenadier... Any idea when yours will arrive?!

[jeremy996]

3 hours ago, reb78 said:

A communication about communication with little to communicate...!!

I am just waiting for the post where you write a review of YOUR Grenadier... Any idea when yours will arrive?!

I am dreaming about that day!

I'm told it has been assembled, but as part of "Batch and Hold", it has not left the Hambach factory. My local agent expects, on not much more than a hunch, that it will be late March. I have signed my contract so I am committed. 

[jeremy996]

The last road test report I have been waiting for landed today, as my subscription copy of Land Rover Monthly, April 2023 arrived. Gary Pusey uses his bit of 'Writers' Rovers" to cover the Scotland junket. There should be a You Tube video, but I could not see it at time of writing, https://www.youtube.com/@landrovermonthly7806/featured 

He seemed to like it, after a bit of a wobble about too much electrickery and whining from other hacks about the steering.

 

[Daan]

Does britpart sell grenadier parts?

[Happyoldgit]

On 2/28/2023 at 6:20 PM, jeremy996 said:

The last road test report I have been waiting for landed today, as my subscription copy of Land Rover Monthly, April 2023 arrived. Gary Pusey uses his bit of 'Writers' Rovers" to cover the Scotland junket. There should be a You Tube video, but I could not see it at time of writing, https://www.youtube.com/@landrovermonthly7806/featured 

He seemed to like it, after a bit of a wobble about too much electrickery and whining from other hacks about the steering.

 

Interesting read. Is there a page missing.

19/24 mpg 😳

[jeremy996]

9 minutes ago, Happyoldgit said:

Interesting read. Is there a page missing.

19/24 mpg 😳

No page missing, it's part of Writer's Rovers and the next page is someone else. As for the MPG, I'd suggest that is slightly pessimistic, as they are using a more rigorous test regime. That said, the driver makes the biggest single difference.

2 hours ago, Daan said:

Does britpart sell grenadier parts?

Not yet! Ineos will not honour the warranty if you don't use factory parts, so I'd guess that is 5 years away. Ineos are welcoming towards the aftermarket for add-on gadgets and other shiny things, so I would expect most of the usual suspects to develop a Grenadier range, (or more likely, rebadge some existing camping, overlanding or convenience trinkets).

[jeremy996]

YouTube video from a slightly off stage source, a classic car dealer with a long Land Rover history.

 

Edited March 5, 2023 by jeremy996
speeling

[jeremy996]

New YouTube video from "The Underpowered Hour", talking about various things, including Mercedes Lilienthal talking about the Grenadier. Nothing too novel and nearly a hour of talking heads. (IA content from 7:30 to 50:00, US based Freelander content at 52:00).

 

 

Edited March 7, 2023 by jeremy996
Add some timings

[jeremy996]

 I am assured that everything is moving along; one of the dealers, (Steve at Halliwell Jones Chester), put up a picture of the hardback manual. There has been a little debate about how thick it is!

 

Edited March 13, 2023 by jeremy996
Credit the photo

[elbekko]

10 hours ago, jeremy996 said:

There has been a little debate about how thick it is!

50% is about the BMW i-Drive probably.

[Escape]

On 3/5/2023 at 4:31 PM, jeremy996 said:

YouTube video from a slightly off stage source, a classic car dealer with a long Land Rover history.

Sounds a lot like an infomerchial... I'm sure they got a good deal on their Grenadier. I don't really get it though, if they don't do offroad, surely there are better tow cars to be found, less compromised on road. Like the new Defender, or a Disco or Range.

Also made me chuckle when he was praising the lack of elektronics and at the same time showing the center Ipad that replaces the traditional dash. 😁