Peterborough, the new Billing?

[simonr]

Just home from the LRO Peterborough show - and I thought it was fantastic! Really nice atmosphere, the weather helped but I think it would have been good even if it was snowing!

It feels like Billing did mid 90's - much more club & family centred. Billing this year on the other hand was looking a bit shabby. Date changes, LRO abandoning it and a decline in attentance makes me wonder if it's finally had it's day and maybe should be allowed to die peacefully?

Many of the traders are whispering that they would prefer not to go to Billing next year - and someone told me that the site has in fact been bought by Centre Parks, so it may not happen next year anyway!

Just wondered how you all feel?

Si

[pat_pending]

I thought Billing died years ago. I've been to Peterborough the past couple of years and thought it far better.

I didn't go this year as it was predicted to be as hot as last year, too much for me.

So yes, Peterborough wins hands down, now move the date back a week or two.

[smallfry]

Yes, I thought that too. Billing in the ninties was great, although its sad that the big boys like Craddocks et al dont attend shows any more. I am told this is a result of the internet, and they dont need the exposure now........and then theres the fees.

I also couldn't help wondering as I looked around the used parts on sale, how much of it is from stolen vehicles.........

Then there is all the stuff which is outright junk, personally i would skip a lot of it, and cant understand why traders would keep carting round heavy boxes of knackered hinges for example....................

Really enjoyed it though.

[missingsid]

I lost interest in shows when it became "Extreme" for everything now it is all mega expensive trendy 90s. The arena bit never really workrd for me and most off road courses are for families.

I am supprised they suit you Si as your customers know what they want already but you do get to socialise with those you know and get to put a face to those you don't.

My family have no interest in walking around and only humour me with their time so i have to sure of what I want to see.

To be fair I am not the target market for these. shows anyway.

Sorry a bit negative.

Marc

[simonr]

I find the shows very useful. I can see that for Craddocks who are selling standard parts, you know pretty much what you are buying (or at least you hope you do). If you are trying to sell something that is new to the market or different to standard, people like to see it. Talking to the person who has designed it and hearing the back story and how & why it came into existence is a great confidence boost when they are parting with large sums of money!

Shows are great for the people who have just bought a Land Rover and do not know what is available or anything about the reputations of the different companies. Talking to them and seeing if you like them (believe they are not simply after your money) is really helpful. On the whole, they tend to buy something small & cheap - if it turns out to be good, they come back for more! Very often I get phone calls which start "I bought one of your X at a show and.....".

The other common thing is people wanting to 'hide' what they are buying from SWMBO. Much easier at a show than if she (or he) has to sign for it when it arrives!

Si

[Eightpot]

I thought it was a good show too - it's a shame it's not held at Eastnor anymore as that's a much nicer location for camping, but Eastnor was a nightmare last year when it rained!

It is a shame a lot of traders don't attend anymore, I keep taking a fat wad of money with me to spend on goodies but come away almost empty handed everytime - unless you're after a cheap chinese socket set, a rusty hinge or a £60k diamond crusted 90 there isn't much to buy.

[simonr]

I saw some pretty good stuff at Peterborough! Lots of suspension bits - and some quite clever ideas in them. I only wish I had more time to wander around. I intended to go talk to Raptor & get them to make me a new Td5 dash Panel to spec. At the last show, he said to take photos of my dash & bring them to the next one - but time was against me!

The best bit in all the magazines is the New Products section. The shows are often the chance to see it all in the flesh!

Si

[Happyoldgit]

I haven't attended P'boro for a couple of years or so but have been of the opinion that Billing has been well past it's sell by date for a long time, it was ok back in the days when new and fresh but outgrew the venue a long time ago.

[tacr2man]

The "Shows" lost it for me years ago , as they became a show for traders , and event marketers, wheareas they were a landrover show for enthusiasts, that traders came to , originally . The landrover world has become a very lucrative business, as with many its a hobby, you only have to look at golf , which is probably what was the current inspiration , eg the knackered hinges etc . and the costs to go are going ever higher , another negative response I am afraid to say. Whats going to happen in the future as the Landrover marque morphs to trendy SUV owners , they wont be going to shows ! JMHO

[mickeyw]

I have only once been to a LR show at Peterborough, yonks ago, and I don't think it was the same show they run now.

This is the first year I have missed Billing since I started going, although I do wonder why I bothered at least the last 2 times I went. Oh hang on there was a good reason last year, I bought a X-pedal lock . Si, you are one of a very small number of companies in attendance that offer goods I would actually buy.

I miss the like of DLS, Craddocks et al. I used to pick up a load of the smaller LR consumable and service items from them.

I've done Eastnor once, a few years back, mind. It's not exactly local for me, but I enjoyed it as it seemed a lot more enthusiasty and friendly than other shows.

I think Billing has seen the last of me, but this thread is inspiring me to trek a little further north next year

[CwazyWabbit]

Have to agree with you Mickey, last time I went to Billing (last year) I had a list of consumables I thought I'd pick up while I was there ..... couldn't even find an oil filter! Although I do always love going for a nose around the X-Eng stand and a quick fiddle with Nige's diff display was interesting.

I reckon next year will see me heading further north if I attend a show.

[muttleyd]

Didn't make either show this year, but have felt Peterborough has improved over the last few years with Billing gradually fading. Remember the first time I went thinking it was a great show with lots of clubs and spares, but gradually the stands have reduced with less Landrover content. Shame really as Billing is only a 15 minute drive from me. Its always nice to meet the people you deal with. Great to meet up with Nige on Xeng stand a few years ago, and its great to always see the quality of the products you are looking to buy, and come across new stuff that does not always make the mags. Hope you continue to support the shows Si its always good to see your new ideas

[discomark10]

I have to agree, Billing has gone down hill.. I went this year and a while ago. Even in 2011 it was much better

[pat_pending]

Out of interest Si, how much is a stand at one of these shows?

[Smego]

Obviously changed from last year as that was very slow..

[smallfry]

unless you're after a cheap chinese socket set, a rusty hinge or a £60k diamond crusted 90 there isn't much to buy.

Just about sums it up really. Most of the stuff on show, and the sums of money involved, are way beyond the means of the average enthusiast, and to me, goes away from a Land Rover is really about.

[lil_me]

For us as a smaller trader it's a useful show to see what is coming out from some companies

It's a chance to see the manufacturers, speak with them, decide who to deal with and who not to. Often based on build quality, attitude and knowledge

Peterborough wasn't as good this year as it was last year IMO, less traders, more expensive food, lots of empty spaces.

What is also alarming is the 'won't be around for long' companies with stock that looks pretty but god awful products, badly made for whatever reason welding issues and saved by a grinder, unsafe wiring, badly thought out amongst others. There's a market for these as they're often cheap, but my goodness it's scary what some will buy. Stack it high and sell it cheap seems the name of their game. Then you get better quality from say raptor and x who are thought out well, designed properly, longer lasting. Someone making racks of stuff from odd off cuts at work & cheap who can compete with that for the want a bargain buyers?

2 shows that look promising to take off are Donnington & Harrogate. Donnington because it is not just Land Rover, Harrogate was just a really pleasant well organised show, I really enjoyed it

The issue for me with Billing is it is spoilt by thefts and morons, a real shame

Eightpot totally get what you mean but the popularity of these stalls are reducing, there were some of the 'cheque book' companies who were really struggling for punters all weekend. They would be better placed at somewhere like the Top Gear show where you're more likely to find someone who doesn't want to self build and wants something pretty. There are some good companies providing the average owner with some innovative and interesting products, but filtering these from the carp, is not easy. Seen way too many items including from one or 2 bigger suppliers that made my eyes pop out as you just wouldn't take something that was built so badly to a show

[henk]

This time was my first visit to Peterborough after about 10 visits to Billing in the last 13 years including this year and conclusion is that I will not go to Billing any longer but maybe alternate between Eastnor and Peterborough.

I am only interested in Land Rover related stands but not at all in candy's, sweets, flowershops or carp stands you see more and more in Billing.

Talked to a lot of traders (including Si) and they more or less all agree that Billing is over.

Did not go to Eastnor this year but seemed the weather was excellent (compared with the rain last year) and seemed it was a very good show.

And for sure the organisation in Eastnor (Mark W) is far more flexible than Live Promotion

[simonr]

Out of interest Si, how much is a stand at one of these shows?

Usually about £60 per meter of frontage.

Most of the shows used to charge differentr amounts depending on where in the showground you went (which makes sense because some are definitely better than other. Then Live got involved - and all areas were the same, more expensive rate. Donnington is absolutely the best value. IIRC it was about £150 and I turned over more than a single day at any other show - which typically cost about £250 per day.

Si

[geoflse]

Thought I'd never say this, but we aren't going to Billing again. We've bee every year since 1997, but this year I couldn't even find a set of new shock absorbers for the 90. There was a trader selling 2nd hand ones!!

We're considering Harrogate next year. A lot closer to us.

Geoff

[simonr]

I've been to every Billing since 1992 - so I only missed the first one! Similarly, I doubt I'll go to the next one!

Si

[FridgeFreezer]

What about Sodbury - that's always been the "other" annual pilgrimage for LR owners?

I had fun at the last Billing I went to (yonks ago now), but the amount of theft in the campsite put a major downer on things.

To my mind, Sodbury is the place to stock the workshop up (used bits, consumables, tools, etc.) or empty the workshop out and the shows are kinda like the "ideal home exhibition" - I'm unlikely to buy anything major, but it's good to wander round, see new ideas and gear etc., and catch up with people.

[Happyoldgit]

I've been to every Billing since 1992 - so I only missed the first one! Similarly, I doubt I'll go to the next one!

Si

I remember going to some kind of Land Rover or 4x4 shows somewhere or other back in the late '80's. I thought that was Billing but obviously somewhere else?

[Mo Murphy]

I missed Peterborough this year because of our trip but I did get to Billing. However, as much as I enjoyed Billing, it has had it's day, lacking Land Rover interest. As mentioned above, I miss the days of DLS and the other parts retailers presence when I could walk around and browse for things I liked, wanted and could (possibly) afford, when I bought mats, window winders, air filters, batteries and windscreen seals

Now alas at all the shows, there's a few bling suppliers and expensive "overland" outfitters and neither really hold any interest for me. Nor do the second hand parts stalls hold any interest with their hopelessly inflated prices.

I don't mind the odd "other interest" stall or non Land Rover arena display, there are plenty of mums and kids there too who need to be entertained.

The shows that we went to in the nineties have changed and I don't think we'll see the like of them again.

RIP proper Land Rover shows, I miss you.

Mo

[studmuffin]

I would have like to have gone to Peterborough but didn't because its well to the bottom left hand side of our fair isle and is an absolute pig for me and a lot of other people to get to. Just because LRO are based in that area and run the show, its simply a terrible geographical choice for a great many of us.

Barry